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Dupes took over the world

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Re: Dupes took over the world

#71

Post by margalabargala »

free652 wrote: post #58
margalabargala wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Champagne is absolutely not a "generic" product in the US. While some California wines were and still are sold as "California Champagne", there was a court decision back in 2006 which affirmed the same protected trademark for Champagne as in the rest of the world, with the caveat that wineries already using the "Champagne" name would be grandfathered in and permitted to continue doing so. A bottle of Champagne made i…

Champagne isn't a trademark and it's *generic* in US. What happened that in 2006 US signed an agreement with EU. Obviously everything can change. https://www.ttb.gov/system/files/images/pdfs/rulings/2008-1....

The US legal system doesn't have the concept of "trademark" in the way you're using it, that word means something else here.

And no, "trademark" definition aside, it's not "generic" in the US by any definition of "generic" commonly used in the US, legal or otherwise.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#72

Post by scbrg »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #56
cortesoft wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, the guy who invented the horseshoe died thousands of years ago. And the idea that one location making all the horseshoes means each village is minus one living is ignoring the other effects. Now, all the villagers can get cheaper horseshoes, so they don’t have to spend as many resources on shoes for their horses, and can now invest more into what their village is best at, and sell those goods to other villages.…

>Now, all the villagers can get cheaper horseshoes, so they don’t have to spend as many resources on shoes for their horses, and can now invest more into what their village is best at, and sell those goods to other villages. And for a village that had 50 such specialties... they can make do with 49 specialties. Then with 48. And 45 as well. 25 eventually. But some day in the future, their great-grandchildren wake up,…

> And maybe there are even fewer people to worry about this, because when the moved to the city, those people stopped having children.

> Who is this good for? Is it good for you?

Well, as a global population reduction is sorely needed, this is good for pretty much everybody. There's absolutely no way we can keep extracting resources and polluting at the rate demanded by our current enormous population (which has more than doubled in my life time).

Unfortunately, your theory isn't working, as the population still grows.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#73

Post by picofarad »

coldtea wrote: post #40
secabeen wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because Fanatics took over the jersey manufacture and cut the quality. Fanatics sucks in all sort of dimensions.

I don't think it's uniquely Fanatics. All kinds of "luxury" brands have been dropping their quality standards for several decades now. And not for making some mass market cheaper products, but on their regular supposedly "luxury" lines.

They made a name over decades and now they're going to ride the name till the end of the company.

I really do wonder if MBA == evil.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#74

Post by superxpro12 »

Joker_vD wrote: post #27
wat10000 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The opposite is actually true in reality. More people can afford X than ever before, for nearly any X that doesn’t involve directly paying for someone else’s labor.

Depends on the overarching economical policies. During the British rule, the Indian textile weavers went out of manufacturing business and had to switch to sustenance farming, and then perish during one of the many famines. And the Parliament legally forbade the public relief efforts, such as fundraisers to buy and send corn to the affected regions, explicitly citing the concerns that such efforts would skew the mark…

That seems less an indictment of economies of scale, and more an indictment of british colonialism

Re: Dupes took over the world

#75

Post by superxpro12 »

This kind of leaves out the biggest question imo which is that of quality.

Usually, dupe's sacrifice quality for price. The fact that a market exists for this at all indicates a strong consumer acceptance of lower quality items.

I do wonder, if the "premium" option were to never exist, would these "dupes" even exist in the first place as they seem to enjoy an "implied" quality that the premium option pays for, whilst cannibalizing sales.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#76

Post by _carbyau_ »

RobotToaster wrote: post #38
cjs_ac wrote: post #7

> When Deckers, the company behind fleece-lined UGG boots, recently took Quince to court over its lookalike boots, it tried to bar Quince from referencing “dupe culture” at trial. > The bid failed, confirming that “dupes” and “dupe culture” — a commercial ecosystem built around providing consumers cheaper alternatives to name-brand products — are cultural phenomena here to stay. > The trial focused on whether Quince’…

Came here to say this. Deckers UGGs are cheap Chinese knockoffs of the Australian original.

This feels like it wasn't quite worded well.

But yeah, when Deckers bought the Ugg brand name the quality went down. Similar to Dunlop Volleys which are now crappy quality too. I don't buy either now.

Might as well get any other brands version of the same thing - the quality is unlikely to be any worse. Hell, my kid opted for fluffy crocs instead even though they are yet to truly know the word bogan...

Re: Dupes took over the world

#77

Post by mjmas »

t0mpr1c3 wrote: post #53
mjmas wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A generic Australian product. But however Deckers owns Ugg as a trademark everywhere but here and NZ. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ugg_boots_trademark_dispute

Yes. In contrast to Mozzarella, Champagne, and many others which are generic products in the USA, and protected trademarks in their region of origin. I didn't realise the trademark holder is a US company.

To clarify, Uggs originated in Australia and are a generic term here. Deckers owns a trademark outside Australia and is enforcing it against people in Australia.

It would be like if a US company registered Champagne as a trademark then enforced it against French companies selling it.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#78

Post by Joker_vD »

bruce511 wrote: post #60
inigyou wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just shows how powerful capital interests are.

I always find this line of thought interesting. Because it implies the manufacturer has all the power. But they don't. The consumer does. Ultimately the manufacturer wins the horse-shoe battle because they are cheaper. And the consumers in the village prefer cheap shoes to locally made (expensive) ones. Fundamentally consumers like cheap stuff. Manufacturing shifts happen because as soon as there's a cheaper output,…

> I always find this line of thought interesting. Because it implies the manufacturer has all the power. But they don't. The consumer does.

There is difference between the political power and the economical power. The economical power of the aggregate consumer is vast, but it's unconsolidated, and doesn't usually translate into the political power. The economical power of several centralized/monopolized producers is also vast, but it's consolidated and usually does translate into the political power. Plus, you know, class consciousness and all that — the gentlemen and the nobles in the Parliament may bicker and backstab each other, but the moment the peasants revolt against the Enclosure Acts, they put their differences behind them and start the hangings.

> Ultimately the manufacturer wins the horse-shoe battle because they are cheaper.

Yeah, but they can speed their victory up by paying the legislature (or straight up being a large part of that legislature) to crack down on those small-scale manufacturers. License the blacksmithing itself, require obtaining certificates of quality for horseshoes for sale, and tax shoe-fitting unless it's done with the authorized horseshoes — and that's only barely scratching the surface.

Re: Dupes took over the world

#79

Post by defen »

_carbyau_ wrote: post #76
RobotToaster wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Came here to say this. Deckers UGGs are cheap Chinese knockoffs of the Australian original.

This feels like it wasn't quite worded well. But yeah, when Deckers bought the Ugg brand name the quality went down. Similar to Dunlop Volleys which are now crappy quality too. I don't buy either now. Might as well get any other brands version of the same thing - the quality is unlikely to be any worse. Hell, my kid opted for fluffy crocs instead even though they are yet to truly know the word bogan...

So what are the good Australian boot/shoe brands now?

Re: Dupes took over the world

#80

Post by solumunus »

JimsonYang wrote: post #67
zkmon wrote: post #59

"Dupe" might need to be more specific. What is copied? Is it design, brand name, quality, parts or functionality? What is not to be copied? and why? Dupe might affect the seller, but customer doesn't care much. In the past, people had to go by brand name as an assurance of quality. We have other means now. Reviews from other buyers, detailed specifications, return policies - all reduced the moat of branding. People c…

> what is not being copied and why? Most counterfeits goods skimp on manufacturing quality. Like instead of very detailed stitching with intricate design they might just skip that altogether. For instance one of the easiest ways to identify dupes is if the brand name and design on a bag 'flows' to the other side. Obv counterfeits dont really care because they want to save money For counterfeit goods that are so high…

For luxury brand bags that cost $2-10k you pay around $300-600 for high quality counterfeits, but they really are almost identical. Sometimes they are higher quality.
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