Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Qwen 3.8

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

511–520 of 793 posts

Re: Qwen 3.8

#511

Post by girvo »

asdewqqwer wrote: post #410
edm0nd wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah the Chinese totally have a really good history with being completely open and giving lol. The Chinese government totally has not been hacking into American and Western fortune 500 companies for the past few decades stealing R&D and tech to use for themselves. The Chinese also totally do not steal hundreds of billions of dollars of IP from America annually. Totally not something they would do!

It is hilarious to see people from arguable the most polarized political systems in the world believing the evil 1.5 billion people across the sea share one single mind, either a saint, or a devil.

But that’s not what they said?

Re: Qwen 3.8

#512

Post by ycui7 »

jimbob45 wrote: post #347
dannyw wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like my Apache 2.0 licensed Gemma, and NVIDIA’s Nemotrons are decent bases for finetuning or continued pretraining, esp thanks to good documentation and tooling. Oh, and Mira’s thinking machines lab dropped Inkling, a ~1T open weight model too. This isn’t US vs China. This is open vs closed.

This isn’t open though. Promises to be open later aren’t worth anything, given what we’ve seen and heard from AI execs making promises in this industry.

it takes extra effort to open source a model even if you had it running internally. even traditional software takes extra effort to get released as open source.

Re: Qwen 3.8

#513

Post by Art9681 »

gardnr wrote: post #6
adrian_b wrote: post #4

I assume that this announcement has been prompted by that of Moonshot AI, which has just announced a 2.8T parameter open-weights LLM, Kimi K3, to be published on Huggingface by 27 July. Now the response of Alibaba is that they will also publish soon a big open weights LLM, the 2.4T parameter Qwen 3.8. I wonder if Alibaba has always planned to make this big LLM open weights, or they have chosen to do this now, to bett…

It's hard to say what their motivation is. The Chinese firms seem to be working hard to commoditize intelligence which may be the most effective way to debase American frontier labs. And yeah: it also happens to be really good for humanity.

Wait till they get the heretic treatment. It's going to be great.

Re: Qwen 3.8

#514

Post by KennyBlanken »

hluska wrote: post #496
oceanplexian wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's hard to say what their motivation is. Not for anyone who reads history. Back in the late 18th century, England was the world's top economy, in big part due to its textile industry. England had an export ban on the technology, but textile worker named Samuel Slater brought blueprints over (Supposedly in response to a bounty posted in a newspaper by the US government!). The technology diffused rapidly because th…

Samuel Slater did not bring blueprints over. His father died when he was 14 and he was indentured to a mill at that time. Over the next seven years (as an indentured apprentice) he received some pretty decent training in both how to operate and maintain a 32 spindle Arkwright mill. He memorized parts of the blueprints and moved to the United States. Over seven years, it would be hard not to learn parts of the mill yo…

Mill owners like him are precisely why New England states have child labor laws. My state prohibits anyone under 18 from operating any kind of machinery.

Why? Because mill owners would send kids into running machines to keep them running, and they'd get turned into hamburger.

Also, they'd grow up knowing how to do mill work but be useless to society for anything else.

gestures at southern coal states

gestures at midwest farming states

Re: Qwen 3.8

#515

Post by venussnatch »

windsignaling wrote: post #487
mceachen wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please don't conflate a volunteer effort with no expected economic gain with a very well funded company (or fleet of companies). With the CCP's highly successful track record with subsuming other markets, Occam's razor applies to why they're doing this.

There is clearly an anti-China bias here. Show me comments demonstrating the same level of distrust against Google for open-sourcing projects like Tensorflow, Kubernetes, Flutter, Chromium, etc.

The chromium example is wild. There's an extreme distrust and contempt for chromium becoming the defacto browser and therefore Google becoming the defacto gatekeeper of the web.

Re: Qwen 3.8

#516

Post by monocasa »

KerrAvon wrote: post #507
Grombobulous wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think most of us that will claim to understand China are going to end up being wrong, unless any of us live there or grow up there. There’s a saying about China I have heard from ex-pats: the more you know about China, the less you know about China. The point of me bringing that up is to say that what follows is really just my best guess: If I were to judge from China’s approach to hardware, I think that the compan…

>The real reason we are using Claude is for the SaaS aspect of it. It has a toolchain, a friendly interface, and a bunch of integrations with business applications. That is a very thin moat, though. There's nothing you can do with, for example, Claude Code + Opus 4.8 that you can't do with your own custom harness running API-level Opus 4.8, which means that if you can afford the hardware (the moat for running any SOT…

All the more reason to treat it as a commoditize your complement situation.

Re: Qwen 3.8

#517

Post by culi »

fidelramos wrote: post #437
mikae1 wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In any case, from this competition in LLMs, we win. Do we really though? Everyone is wasting resources doing almost exactly the same thing. Climate loses, we lose.

Doing "almost exactly the same thing" is fubdamental to competition and capitalism. The ones doing it better will survive, that's how we improve. About climate, I think you overplay it. China is already investing heavily in nuclear, and we should be doing the same.

Alibaba (who makes Kimi) and Moonshot AI (who makes Qwen) collaborate closely. Qwen relies on Alibaba's infrastructure for training.

Look at your iPhone and you'll see all the greatest inventions have been born out of collaboration not competition:

* GPS was created by the Department of Defense

* the internet was created through the collaboration of many international research institutions

* speech recognition came from MIT and DARPA

* AI voice assistants were created by DARPA. Apple immediately hired the head of the program after it was finished to create Siri

* accelerometers (MEMS) is another DARPA innovation from the 90s

* touchscreens were invented by CERN

* digital cameras came out of Bell Labs which had a government-mandated monopoly that required them to fund research like this

* lithium-ion batteries were created through a collaboration between British, Japanese, and American organizations

All of these have only become transformative technologies because they were created with public funding and released to the public. It's collaboration and public funding that drives innovation

Re: Qwen 3.8

#519

Post by Aurornis »

overgard wrote: post #495

I've been using Qwen 3.6 27B with LMStudio, and I was pleasantly surprised with it, although it was a little slow. I found mtplx last night, and it really wasn't an exaggeration to say that it ran the model 2-3x faster which was super impressive. I'm trying to move to local models as much as I can, and I'm finding that it's becoming more and more practical. Admittedly this is on a $6000 dollar laptop (M5 Max Macbook…

> Admittedly this is on a $6000 dollar laptop (M5 Max Macbook with the specs maxxed out)

Sadly that laptop is likely $8000 now, after the recent price increase.

Re: Qwen 3.8

#520

Post by lardosaurusrex »

halJordan wrote: post #468
lardosaurusrex wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

at the risk of upsetting a lot of people mentioning this but like are you really surprised? if youre going to use ai for everything youre gonna start losing your edge as you focus less and less on what youre doing and this isnt me just talking out my ass, like... the front page here is peppered with study after study and blogpost after blogpost about how its overuse can come to the detriment of one's own abilities an…

This is the sort of unmitigated pedantry thats the real problem. Everyone makes typos and errors of this nature. Feymann and Hemmingway both did. You deliberately chose this level of error multiple times when you chose to not put an apostrophe in youre and failed to capitalize proper nouns Come off that high horse

i literally have no idea what you're talking about my dude/gal and/or pal.

i just dont have autocorrect turned on; chill.

Post reply on HN