Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

queue.acm.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

131–140 of 285 posts

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#131

Post by sneak »

inigyou wrote: post #120
sneak wrote: post #106

> Right now, there is a LOT of shrill propaganda from the tech bros, who call themselves “privacy advocates,” about how mandatory age checking is the gateway drug to comprehensive identity checks on the entire Internet, and ridiculing the valid civic concerns governments are trying to address as merely “think of the children” strawman arguments. Oh, it’s not a slippery slope. It’s a single step: age verification IS i…

What is the Digital Age Assurance Act in California? Is it identity verification? If so, how?

State-based regulations on tech are largely irrelevant. See CCPA for an example.

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#132

Post by listic »

r_lee wrote: post #56

> my personal guess is that the opportunities for anonymity on the Internet will shrink until mothers no longer are forced to have “the talk” when their daughters get their first mobile phone. As the parent of a daughter, I am totally on board with that. depends on the age but.. they've probably discovered all kinds of shit already or heard about it from others

> until mothers no longer are forced to have “the talk” when their daughters get their first mobile phone

I fail do imagine what kind of world is he implying.

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#133

Post by [deleted] »

andix wrote: post #23

I don't think age restriction will impact FOSS in the long term. If there are some regulations that threaten FOSS now, they are going to be adopted in the long term. Regulations for age restriction are understandable. A lot of modern technology is harming kids (and I don't mean dirty videos, social media seems to be much more harmful). A sensible regulator would leave some responsibility to the parents, but require r…

[deleted]

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#134

Post by II2II »

logifail wrote: post #36
andix wrote: post #23

I don't think age restriction will impact FOSS in the long term. If there are some regulations that threaten FOSS now, they are going to be adopted in the long term. Regulations for age restriction are understandable. A lot of modern technology is harming kids (and I don't mean dirty videos, social media seems to be much more harmful). A sensible regulator would leave some responsibility to the parents, but require r…

> A sensible regulator would leave some responsibility to the parents (Speaking as a parent of three) why can't we just leave all responsibility to the parents? In our experience in the offline world it seems this applies! I speak as someone who's taken each of my three children - for two of them, multiple times - to the emergency room to be treated for broken bones incurred in the course of Real Life[tm]. Yes, they…

> (Speaking as a parent of three) why can't we just leave all responsibility to the parents?

Then I'm sure that you appreciate that there are both legal and informal checks in place ensuring that you can take responsibility for your children in the offline world. For example: I would be surprised if your children were able to play organized sports without your permission. Failing to ask for permission would deny you the responsibility of protecting your child as you see fit.

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#135

Post by vanderZwan »

lysace wrote: post #115
throw0101a wrote: post #61

For those unaware, PHK created (amongst other things) the MD5crypt password hashing algorithm ( $1$… ). It came before bcrypt (1999), scrypt (2009), SHA2crypt (2016), etc , and was committed in 1994: * https://svnweb.freebsd.org/base/head/lib/libcrypt/crypt.c?re... * https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd-src/commit/3b2b7f71deba2a... * https://phk.freebsd.dk/sagas/md5crypt/ * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poul-Henning_Ka…

To clarify: not MD5 itself. It was created in 1991 by Ron Rivest. (It is my experience that knowledge of these things isn't as widely distributed as one might hope.) I first came across it in 1995/1996: Wow, what a magical tool for backend web stuff! I used it for everything.

Wait, is that the same guy who co-authorer the Floyd-Rivest Algorithm? Hmm, looks like it[0]. Huh, neat.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floyd%E2%80%93Rivest_algorithm

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#136

Post by MetaWhirledPeas »

MetaWhirledPeas wrote: post #125

I had to stop reading halfway through to respond. > In comparison, tech sisters advocating for an absolute right to privacy seem to be a very rare, and maybe mythical, species. Ever heard of Meredith Whittaker? > We could have designed our protocols to be minimally compatible with “a nation of laws,” but the tech bros insisted that compromise was treason, and, as a result, we will lose more privacy than necessary. Th…

I finished the article. My own bad prediction: If FOSS "dies" it will continue to thrive in 3rd world countries, where no one bothers to administer punishment for the heinous crime of not letting your government's LLM read every word you type. The 1st world will ignore all this until it becomes apparent that the (former) 3rd world countries are suddenly in a position to economically surpass everyone else, and at that point the wise will see that their desire to keep a stranglehold on online activity was actually a bad idea that allowed their dominance to wane and wither.

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#137

Post by saghm »

armchairhacker wrote: post #80
saghm wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly disagree. There are no kids in my household, and no one else ever uses my devices, so the idea that I need to prove that I'm not a kid for me to be able to pay bills or file taxes on a stock device is ridiculous.

"Age restriction" can be implemented where stock devices are completely unrestricted. For example, just with better parental controls and education: children don't have access to property, so the parent takes their device and enables the parental controls, but you own your device so leave them disabled. And this wouldn't affect Linux or FOSS: on a child's device their parent installs either a proprietary OS or a FOSS…

That's not what the comment I responded to was proposing:

> Maybe even enable age restrictions by default, block replacing the OS or the firmware, and only allow it once the age was confirmed.

Having an extra hurdle before installing Linux would be an awful secondary effect for this type of regulation independent of whether the check itself is already objectionable (which I always obviously think it is, although obviously plenty of people also don't)

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#138

Post by saghm »

dash2 wrote: post #83
saghm wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what's hard to understand. Regulation that affects people and devices that have no risk of being used for the purported thing that's supposed to be protected against is not well-scoped.

Obviously if the government knew that you had no kids, they wouldn't need to check it. How do you propose they find out, without asking you to prove it?

> How do you propose they find out, without asking you to prove it?

How do I propose the government know if I have kids? I'm pretty sure they already know that I don't?

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#139

Post by hinkley »

vanderZwan wrote: post #135
lysace wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To clarify: not MD5 itself. It was created in 1991 by Ron Rivest. (It is my experience that knowledge of these things isn't as widely distributed as one might hope.) I first came across it in 1995/1996: Wow, what a magical tool for backend web stuff! I used it for everything.

Wait, is that the same guy who co-authorer the Floyd-Rivest Algorithm? Hmm, looks like it[0]. Huh, neat. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floyd%E2%80%93Rivest_algorithm

Also the same Rivest as Cormen, Leiserson and Rivest (that Stein dude was after my time), and the R in RSA.

Re: Goodbye, and Thanks for All the Bikesheds

#140

Post by dzonga »

I think the author is missing a layer of abstraction.

yeah - once regulators come into play - the private ecosystems take over. discord is already a precursor to this.

the era of mass public social networks will come to the end. next it will be just private networks of individuals. likely the won't interact.

how the dynamics play out - I don't know - but if you study history - you will know what behaviors will happen.

Post reply on HN