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What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

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Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#241

Post by danudey »

janalsncm wrote: post #227
Stromgren wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a hell of a difference between a tool that asks my permission to read a file to make it part of a prompt and a tool that packages up my whole working directory and sends it to Google Cloud Storage.

Depending on how many files it requests to read, in practice there might not be a difference at all.

Well, excepting that there's a toggle to turn off 'improving the model' (i.e. don't use my repo for training data) and it still uploads your entire repository, git history, etc., all of which can be fetched locally and fed to the model rather than uploading it to a bulk storage bucket.

Add to that the fact that this also includes env files, which may contain secrets that aren't part of the repo, that don't need to be fed to the model, and that might now be leaked.

Which leads us to the third thing: if this bucket weren't discovered and Grok didn't turn this 'feature' off, imagine the disaster fallout if someone ever managed to get read access to this bucket.

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#242

Post by danudey »

ben_w wrote: post #201
OxO4 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

There's many reasons to not use Musk's products, but if you wish to convince people who don't already buy into that description (or worse, who like that description), I would instead focus on the "this endangers your secrets" angle. Business secrets if you're a business, government secrets if you're a government, military secrets if you're military.

Imagine the fallout if someone discovered a method of read access to this bucket.

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#243

Post by dang »

looksjjhg wrote: post #170
dang wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" Eschew flamebait. Avoid generic tangents. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: I suppose I'd better add that this is not a defense of $THAT_GUY - just an attempted defense of HN comment quality. Edit 2: Could you please stop posting unsubstantive comments and flamebait generally? It's not what this site is for, and destroys what it is for. For example, we ban accounts that post things like https…

It’s funny how you’re always policing me and not the thousands of other people that are posting much worse things. I’d be happy if there was a version where I can just see links, comments and add posts to favourites. That’s all I need really.

It always feels like the mods are against you, and it always feels like others are doing worse. These are fixtures of internet forum psychology and you are far from the only one who feels that way.

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&que...

If you see a post that ought to have been moderated but hasn't been, the likeliest explanation is that we didn't see it. You can help by flagging it or emailing us at hn@ycombinator.com.

https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...

Still, other people breaking the site guidelines doesn't make it ok for you to also break them, and pointing the finger at others, as if you needn't correct your own behavior, is unhelpful.

If you've gotten multiple moderation responses, the likeliest reason is that you've broken the site guidelines multiple times. Btw, it's nothing personal—we don't know anything about you—and the answer to your "it's funny" is that it's simply random.

I'm sure it's true that other people have done the same or worse and not gotten the same replies, because that's how randomness works. We do our best within the quantity limits of what we're physically able to read and respond to.

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#244

Post by janalsncm »

danudey wrote: post #241
janalsncm wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on how many files it requests to read, in practice there might not be a difference at all.

Well, excepting that there's a toggle to turn off 'improving the model' (i.e. don't use my repo for training data) and it still uploads your entire repository, git history, etc., all of which can be fetched locally and fed to the model rather than uploading it to a bulk storage bucket. Add to that the fact that this also includes env files, which may contain secrets that aren't part of the repo, that don't need to be…

My point is that I believe those toggles are placebo buttons. You are free to believe that they prevent Grok from slurping up your IP, but the most reliable way to prevent that from happening is to prevent Grok from seeing your IP in the first place.

And by the time you figure out that they have, taking them to court is not going to be reliable recourse.

The same is true for Claude and Codex.

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#245

Post by culi »

charcircuit wrote: post #49
culi wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is completely made up. The Grok Build CLI reference lists no such thing. Whatever LLM you asked probably hallucinated this.

>completely made up If you want easily verifiable evidence, run strings on the Grok Build CLI binary and you will see: Codebase upload skipped: disabled by config (harness.disable_codebase_upload=true)

It does not appear anywhere in the docs.

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#247

Post by kwar13 »

phaseleza wrote: post #48

I always separate the coding tools from LLM providers, and use bubblewrap to sandbox the coding tools so they: 1. Can only read the working project directory, with .git read-only and sensitive directories hidden (mounted as empty directories). 2. Have an isolated network namespace; they can only access the internet through an HTTP proxy hosted on a Unix socket, can only access specific LLM provider hostnames, and exc…

This is the way.

For CC I have a template here https://kaveh.page/blog/claude-code-sandbox

Re: What xAI's Grok build CLI sends to xAI: A wire-level analysis

#249

Post by heylook »

theplumber wrote: post #234
Stromgren wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s a hell of a difference between a tool that asks my permission to read a file to make it part of a prompt and a tool that packages up my whole working directory and sends it to Google Cloud Storage.

Who told you that it needs your permission? You are in Disneyland and you are debating why Mickey Mouse is not handing you over a legal agreement with guarantees on the ingredients of the candy you’ve just got from him.

> Mickey Mouse is not handing you over a legal agreement with guarantees on the ingredients of the candy

yes he absolutely is. that's literally the law.

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