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DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

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Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#61

Post by ipaddr »

unshavedyak wrote: post #51
ipaddr wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is caffeine.

Huh, i should look at this. I've been an aggressive drinker for most of my adult life (2 pots a day at my height) , but for kicks i decided to cut all caffeine for about 9 months. No real issues aside from very short term headaches, though even those i mitigated by gradually moving down in quantity. Aside from the headaches what addictive effects are you referencing?

Side effects of caffeine withdraw? Lack of focus, nervous, poor sleeping, vivid dreams.

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#62

Post by unshavedyak »

ipaddr wrote: post #61
unshavedyak wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh, i should look at this. I've been an aggressive drinker for most of my adult life (2 pots a day at my height) , but for kicks i decided to cut all caffeine for about 9 months. No real issues aside from very short term headaches, though even those i mitigated by gradually moving down in quantity. Aside from the headaches what addictive effects are you referencing?

Side effects of caffeine withdraw? Lack of focus, nervous, poor sleeping, vivid dreams.

Huh, don't think i had any of those. Though arguably i had "Lack of focus", difficult to say how much is due to the lack of caffeine or due to undiagnosed ADHD though.

Generally i felt fine. I'll keep it in mind, thanks

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#63

Post by zingababba »

jambalaya8 wrote: post #48
v8xi wrote: post #31

Theres a guy Grant Harding on YT etc. who sends gas station pills for testing and some of the things he finds are scary. Seriously addictive drugs being sold OTC with no meaningful consumer warning or guardrails

This was happening during the early 2000s, though in more "reputable" places (like nutrition and supplement stores; different "drugs" and chemicals, though). Not really surprised it is still going on in the weird little label producers.

You used to be able to find some wild stuff in GNC ~20 years ago, the 'pro-hormone' era was funny.

All the cannabinoid analogs are a good example too, people just want to get high.

I do miss salvia extracts though. Being able to pick that up in a head shop was nice before it got banned.

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#64

Post by DrBrock »

Ah yeah surely banning more substances will be the end of the problem this time! It definitely won't just push anyone who got hooked on this non-lethal opioid towards unregulated black markets filled with lethal fentanyl...

Fun fact, this is one of two """temporary""" opioid schedulings happening right now. The DEA is also banning 5,6-Dichloro Desmethylchlorphine (SR-17018), which has minimal to no recreational value and is the current most promising breakthrough therapy for opioid withdrawals. It is hard for me to read the combination of these two bans as anything but active malice.

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2026/07/01/2026-13...

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#65

Post by KludgeShySir »

thinkingtoilet wrote: post #24
Centigonal wrote: post #19

Actually reasonable decision from the DEA under RFK. Scheduling concentrated/semi-synthetic kratom products while leaving the weaker leaf-based products alone is a good compromise to reduce harm without criminalizing kratom (which has beneficial uses for opioid recovery and maintenance therapy) in general.

If it actually has beneficial uses let a doctor prescribe it. Kratom is extremely addictive and should be illegal yesterday.

This is a very overblown assertion about kratom. I've heard of people getting addicted, but no one I've known personally has ever had any issues.

I have been using kratom almost daily for about a decade, and it has been one of the most useful substances for managing my physiology in response to my environment. It's great for stress reduction, but my most common use is actually ADHD treatment (which I doubt would be "on-label" if it went through the healthcare clusterf*dge)

The ability to self-titrate is one of **the most important parts**. I know how much I need, and when I need it. With doctors or psychiatrists, you gotta schedule appointments and then try out a dosage for a while, then schedule a recheck and refine the dosage, etc etc etc. I have not had much success with prescription drugs, and I have tried many

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#67

Post by dataflow »

Legend2440 wrote: post #41
kccqzy wrote: post #20

Last year, the FDA had already said that if kratom is added to food, it is considered adulteration of food. It also cannot be a dietary supplement. https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/fda-and-... I’m not fully cognizant of the interaction between FDA and DEA, but I would’ve thought that following FDA’s announcement last year, kratom had already been outlawed.

> I would’ve thought that following FDA’s announcement last year, kratom had already been outlawed. The FDA can say you can't sell it as a supplement or food. But they can't stop you from possessing it or selling it as a chemical. When the DEA schedules it, it is illegal to possess or sell in any capacity.

Interesting that the drug enforcement administration can make it illegal to buy something as a chemical. Their name would suggest that they're merely the enforcement arm of the FDA regarding drugs.

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#68

Post by sweetjuly »

AshamedBadger56 wrote: post #52
ipaddr wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So is caffeine.

This is always mentioned when people talk about addictive substances being widespread. However, I think the key thing to think about isn't whether somethings addictive or not, but if said addiction comes with significant negative consequences/attributes. I don't think you'll find many people saying Caffeine is GOOD for you, but it just doesn't have significant negative outcomes like Tobacco.

Psychology in general tends to make the same distinction. There are lots of behaviors which may be considered abnormal but do not have a meaningful impact on the quality of life of the person or those around them, and so there little reason to pathologize it. The goal of medicine (and, in my mind, well-designed public policy) is to prolong quality of life and not to ensure everything adheres to strict standards.

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#69

Post by NDlurker »

jambalaya8 wrote: post #56
nubinetwork wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought they were talking about krokodil, but nope... I've literally never heard of 7-oh.

yeah, I remember that one, and the bath salts thing. bleh.

Bath salts were synthetic cathinones. Sold online as plant food and bath salts because they were not for human consumption ;) And then they started getting sold in head shops and gas stations. Some are highly addictive, some are more benign. Methylone was a great cheap MDMA alternative and is one of the drugs that Trump signed an executive order to fast track studying for PTSD.

As a guy posting on a nerd message board, you'd probably enjoy the nerdiness of the guys on Bluelight and places like that getting money together to have Chinese labs synthesize the chemicals they theorized would get em high.

Re: DEA to Temporarily Schedule 7-Oh and Related Substances to Protect Public Safety

#70

Post by nozzlegear »

chlorion wrote: post #35
thinkingtoilet wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it actually has beneficial uses let a doctor prescribe it. Kratom is extremely addictive and should be illegal yesterday.

The doctors will prescribe methadone or suboxone instead most likely, both of which are * massively* more powerful and addictive than kratom.

Prescribing opioids in the US is heavily monitored and scrutinized now. Doctors (and NPs, of which my mother is one) have to document the justification, meet state law restrictions, verify the prescription drug monitoring checks with their state, and complete the EHR workflows[†] before they can send in the prescription. There are more checks after that too that the pharmacist has to complete, and the insurance company will have oversight checks they'll do as well.

Not saying people can't or won't get addicted to the drugs prescribed by doctors, but there's a lot more checks and oversight to it (these days) than there is for kratom right now.

[†] At least in my mother's case, their EHR system will also flag opioid prescriptions for review by a board.

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