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Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

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Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#131
post #96

Germany just shut down several perfectly fine nuclear reactors and has some of the dirtiest electricity generation in the entire world They need to look inward before pointing outward.

Just not true https://www.destatis.de/Europa/DE/Thema/Umwelt-Energie/Ausba...

Non-renewable != CO2 intensive (that's how France is doing much better than Germany in CO2 per capita despite being similar in this graph)

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#132

One of the most important solutions is never taken seriously enough, because most people are just big children: eat less meat.

Consumer choices are only going to get you so far

I didn't say it would need to be restricted to individual choice. It could also be a political action from top down.

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#133
post #79

I wouldn't be too worried about it this century at least. if things look like they are going to get bad we will resort to geoengineering, and once we get a taste for it we will further optimize global temperatures to our liking. perversely, global warming earlier than expected is a good thing [for us] as it will wipe away all meaningful opposition to geoengineering. note how according to them having 50C days is a lik…

I'm not convinced that geoengineering is feasible when we can't even seem to stop churning CO2 into the atmosphere. It's far easier to stop the fossil fuel burning than to scrub the atmosphere or set up huge space mirrors, so why do you think that we'll manage to fix the climate? Far more likely is a massive population die off and a collapse of our modern society. At least some people made a lot of money from burning…

It's far easier to start doing stratospheric aerosol injection than to stop burning fossil fuels.

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We'll know European Greens are serious about climate change when they stop decommissioning nuclear plants and replacing them with coal.

I recently wrote a reply to someone else with the same argument about the German greens, which I'll recycle here: "It's bad enough that nuclear proponents ignore the massive cost of nuclear compared to renewables once you factor in building costs, insurance and storage imho. But then to pretend like the conservatives didn't have a choice but to bungle the nuclear exit really is too much. The CDU never listened to the…

What does the German Green Party say in their own political platform today about the use of thermal power plants? Are they in favor of them, to be used to balance the grid when renewable energy fails to meet demand, or are they against the construction and continued use?

I know what the Swedish green party has on their platform, open to be read at any time on their website or in paper materials, or heard by their political representatives. Their position is that thermal power plants are critical to the energy grid in order to enable renewable energy and keeping costs down. They wish to use either bio fuels or green hydrogen to fuel those power plants.

The issue I got with that plan is that current thermal power plants in practice do not use exclusively bio fuels or green hydrogen, and that the environmental science around bio fuels are poor at best and full of green washing and practices that are extremely bad for the environment. The costs of bio fuels and green hydrogen has also demonstrated to be massively expensive, making the cost of nuclear cheap in comparison.

My views of the green will change when/if the green drops their support of thermal power plants, and their overwhelming dependency of using biofuels produced from corn as a way to reduce emissions. Biofuels need to be produced without using artificial fertilizers (natural gas), and without burning down forests to make space for the farming. It also need to be cheaper than nuclear, which disqualify green hydrogen as it is produced, stored and handled currently. Carbon capture and artificial fuels are disqualified on the same point, being overwhelming more expensive than nuclear.

As an anecdote, the Swedish green party leader and a right wing party had a political debate during last election. The Right wing party wanted to demolish an oil fueled thermal power plant that is currently operated in south of Sweden, and replace with new nuclear power plant. Paraphrasing what the green party leader said: "Thermal power plants are a natural part of the Swedish grid, and nuclear energy is way to expensive. We need those plants to keep the grid stable and prices low."

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We'll know European Greens are serious about climate change when they stop decommissioning nuclear plants and replacing them with coal.

I recently wrote a reply to someone else with the same argument about the German greens, which I'll recycle here: "It's bad enough that nuclear proponents ignore the massive cost of nuclear compared to renewables once you factor in building costs, insurance and storage imho. But then to pretend like the conservatives didn't have a choice but to bungle the nuclear exit really is too much. The CDU never listened to the…

Yeah, it's crazy how successful that particular piece of propaganda is. The conservative CDU is responsible for the decommissioning of nuclear plants, while the Greens extended the lifetime of the remaining plants. It's literally the other way around, but people don't question it - it feels too good to complain about the Greens, right?

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

…and what do those data say about China’s emissions?

I'd love to know- ATM I've been on the hop all day and haven't had the time or the access to have a look see .. NASA datasets have less live website presentation this last year. The main point to be landed by that terse comment was that the world isn't merely reliant on CCP statements.

[deleted]

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You conveniently left the US out of that and the US's role in driving global emissions. China is also likely rapidly de-carbonizing right now just like they rapidly spun up. They are an issue, but the US and its policies have a massive impact on this problem. Same with Europe. Rapidly adopting renewables and not externalizing our emissions to other countries would go a long way. I have seen the argument shift from 'T…

China is not rapidly de-carbonizing. They've put off even starting to transition to clean energy by 15 years and they lag behind the other nations. They shouldnt be where the US is as the US has done an awful job. They should be where the EU is.

In 2025 China installed more solar than the US has, and almost more than what the EU has in total. About the same for wind. So yes they're doing it an extreme pace compared to US/EU as we're comparing 1 year to what the EU/US has done for decades.

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#138
post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently wrote a reply to someone else with the same argument about the German greens, which I'll recycle here: "It's bad enough that nuclear proponents ignore the massive cost of nuclear compared to renewables once you factor in building costs, insurance and storage imho. But then to pretend like the conservatives didn't have a choice but to bungle the nuclear exit really is too much. The CDU never listened to the…

What does the German Green Party say in their own political platform today about the use of thermal power plants? Are they in favor of them, to be used to balance the grid when renewable energy fails to meet demand, or are they against the construction and continued use? I know what the Swedish green party has on their platform, open to be read at any time on their website or in paper materials, or heard by their pol…

>What does the German Green Party say in their own political platform today about the use of thermal power plants?

Doesn't matter, at least in Germany. Maybe it's different in other countries, though this would surprise me. Here, nobody reads the party platforms, as they do not correlate with the actions of our political parties.

If you vote according to party platform, then you should probably vote for the conservatives or the reds, as they pretend to be good for the economy and the workers.

I think it's better to judge a party by their actions, instead.

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#139

UK official body of actuaries basically says we are on trajectory of "Extreme" rating: > 3°C or more by 2050. Multiple climate tipping points triggered, tipping cascade. > over 4 billion deaths If so, big shifts would already be imminently felt within next 5-10 years. Remember that there would basically be no place to hide from these direct or knock-on effects. Not for any self sufficient "prepper with a Mac Studio"…

> there will basically no place to hide from these direct or any knock-on effects This is nonsense. (And your own source doesn't support the claim that the consequences of global warming will be unmitigable for anyone.) Many parts of the world will become milder for human occupation as a result of climate change. And nothing realistically forecast is unavoidable with wealth–rich countries will A/C and seawall their w…

Most of the food is grown in certain areas that might not be able to support it anymore. New areas opening up won't be able to be cultivated for decades. Most big cities will cease to function as food supply dwindles. But hey, some enclaves on the outskirts of climate impact and society will not notice so its totally fine and probably even good.

Re: Global Warming at 3 °C by 2050? What's Behind the New German Climate Warning

#140
post #8

If we don’t do something about this, I fear future generations will not view us in a positive light.

I have already accepted that there is nothing plebs can do about climate change. I can try hard by using public transport, using less plastic, and using less air conditioning, but all of those efforts are rendered useless by rich people going on vacation in yachts or private planes. And if you talk about reducing meat consumption, Americans will go mad, lol. Ordinary plebs trying to prevent climate change is like sub…

> Ordinary plebs trying to prevent climate change is like subtracting $100 from a billion dollars - it does not make any meaningful difference.

It stops making any difference if everyone stops trying. You compare this to subtracting $100 from a billion, but a billion dollars is composed of 10 million $100, and there's only a few rich people in those 10 million.

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