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Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

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Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#311

Post by obscurette »

Tubelord wrote: post #282
obscurette wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> calculators didn't make us dumber I think that most of people misunderstand what calculator changed. Calculator didn't replace people doing math, calculator replaced mathematical tables, slide rulers and other already existing devices. And regarding making people dumber ... Math teachers who saw this change said that there was a clear shift – students started to think less critically. With slide rulers and tables y…

You still have to think about significant figures with calculators I used. Most will produce an irrational number result with as many insignificant digits that will fit on the display.

Only with final answer, if you have to round etc. With slide rulers and tables you had to think about it with every step, where to put your decimal separator etc.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#312

Post by solumunus »

Sindisil wrote: post #52

I'm not personally, since I don't use GenAI at all. Especially given the comments I see here and on other tech and programming forums, I hate the direction things are going. I still have some hope this will all fade, but the damage done will be worse the longer it goes on, I think.

The only hope is that subsidised usage stops and somehow LLM’s can’t get any more cost effective from this point. No one is going to drop their guns and pick up a sword if they don’t have to.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#314

Post by quantummagic »

webdood90 wrote: post #262
ofjcihen wrote: post #2

I know that the common refrain is “think of yourself as a manager now” but I’ve actually taken the opposite approach and have been telling anyone I train the same. Diving deeper into technical understanding makes more sense to me at this point both as a way to make yourself more useful in the age of AI and also to use AI more effectively. I regularly tell the kids to grab a text book on a subject that interests them…

The system does not reward deep understanding. It's too slow. An analogy that I think helps describe how I feel about it all: AI is like having cheat codes in a video game. You don't have to try hard and develop a deep understanding of how the game works. You aren't challenged anymore and it doesn't feel like you earned winning the game. It doesn't matter because nobody cares. Businesses truly do not care. You are a…

> It doesn't matter because nobody cares. Businesses truly do not care. You are a cog, a means to an end. It's only about "winning".

A cynical person would tell you that nothing has changed; this was always the way it was. AI didn't change anything in this regard. Maybe it just made it more apparent to you?

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#315

Post by zloy88 »

al_borland wrote: post #118
zloy88 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lol, wdym. I like to prompt it that I want evidence, so when there is any new topic where I currently don't know how to tackle it myself, I ask that it does a research and give me evidence. So i can check the sources myself. Like I said, I let it spoon feed me. When I know upfront how to do anything, I just give all the instructions. But the OPs point was If we offload thinking too much, so that's why I was just thin…

I've found it present wrong, skewed, biased, or old information. In other cases, it seems to ignore the elephant in the room. I find all of these things problematic when trying to learn something new. The less I know about a subject, the more susceptible I am to being mislead. When I bring these things up, it will apologize, tell me I'm right, and adjust. But what if I didn't know enough to question it? Approaching f…

Never rely on the trained data. I always ask to do a research which means, it pulls fresh data from the web. Another thing I enforce all the time is simply "don't make assumptions, give evidence" - that basically means it has to prove from where it takes it's statements. I do pretty fine like that.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#316

Post by pixl97 »

beej71 wrote: post #233
horsawlarway wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Generally speaking - I agree with you. Source bias is a real logical fallacy, and failing to evaluate the content itself, regardless of the source, is a problematic view of the world. In the same way that I don't need the lumber in my house "hand sawed" for it to achieve my goal of creating a habitable space. --- But more broadly, I do think there's space to at least question the use and role of AI. Because while con…

There's a road in California that is the last hand-built road made in the state. Nothing special about it, in particular (aside from the terrifying, exposed drop), otherwise. But since I know the human history of the road, it _feels_ different when I'm on it than other machine-built roads. It's the same in a hand-made house. Knowing the human labor gives the house a different vibe. If we look at 10 paintings and one…

>it _feels_ different when I'm on it than other machine-built roads.

Well, because roads are hard to build and take a lot of energy, it's going to be way narrower, curvier, and hillier. The guy shoveling out rocks all day would have gladly switched the shovel for a bulldozer.

But all of these value statements about value statements are kind of ignoring the Moloch problem in the corner of the room. What becomes the purpose of humans in a world of automation? At our current rate, it's being exterminated under the boots of corporations that swallow up all the value in the universe. The conversation of "How can things be made better for all humankind" seems to have disappeared after the greed is good conversation won.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#317

Post by zloy88 »

Jyaif wrote: post #289
zloy88 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do daily. So far I am doing fine, not sure what exactly your point is, sorry.

For one, as of today SOTA LLMs sometimes take the wrong decisions

For me thinking and making decisions are two different things. I rarely let AI decide, unless it's something i do in my private time. But at work, I am the expert and I maximum let AI give me options, but I decide.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#318

Post by zloy88 »

user43928 wrote: post #69
zloy88 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do daily. So far I am doing fine, not sure what exactly your point is, sorry.

Same here. If anything, I think most here outsource too little thinking to AI. What am I supposed to be afraid of? Losing skills I no longer need to get the job done?

Yea, kinda agree. I feel like my job just changed into a solution architect and quality assurance inspector.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#319

Post by beloch »

zerobees wrote: post #40

I don't know if this is a good framing. "Too much" is subjective, and every heavy AI user will assert that they're just unlocking their potential, that calculators didn't make us dumber, etc. But to latch onto the calculator argument: if you outsource adding numbers to a calculator, you're still you. On the flip side, if you use an LLM do most of your thinking, what's left? We have people here who use LLMs to raise t…

Just to leapfrog off of the calculator notion...

There's a difference between capability and mastery. If you have a calculator, you are capable of doing basic arithmetic (probably). If you can do fairly complex arithmetic in your head, that's mastery. If all you need is capability, it's fair to say that acquiring mastery might be wasted effort. However, if you want to go on to do advanced math, physics, etc., then mastery of basic arithmetic, calculus, algebra, etc. are necessary stepping stones. If you have to go back to calculators, math programs, textbooks, etc. every time for basic things while trying to formulate and manipulate equations, you're going to have a very hard time getting along.

Sure, rely on AI for things that you merely need as capabilities, but recognize that doing so prevents you from developing mastery required to progress to other things. If you don't want to progress to those things, then it's fine. If you do, then you should rethink your approach.

Re: Are we offloading too much of our thinking to AI?

#320

Post by luke5441 »

layer8 wrote: post #139
ofjcihen wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you have my argument backwards

Your argument in that quote is completely unclear. Why do you believe that deep understanding is going to become a commodity soon? How would that happen?

I think the last sentence has a word missing or something, because it contradicts the previous argument a bit.
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