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No Spanish reading crisis?

commonreader.co.uk

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Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#91
post #54

The original article is comparing "a 2023 study showing that only 16% of Americans read for pleasure in a given day, down from the (already low) number of 28% in 2004" with "the percentage of the overall Spanish population that reads for pleasure has increased every year since 2017, reaching 66% in 2025". I think a big part of the discrepancy probably comes from the different time frames. If you ask somebody who read…

My problem with this stuff is that somebody who spent three hours on wikipedia reading about the War of the Triple Alliance is usually counted as somebody who didn't read for pleasure that day.

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#92
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Prince from Machiavelli is required In Spain? Never heard of that, and would not make sense. An italian author writting about politics in Florence?

Why would it not? Divine Comedy and Jack London were both required reading in my Ukrainian school (in translation of course). So was tolstoevsky unfortunately.

Because we have a lot of authors from what we call "golden years", and "Spanish Literature" teachers tend to be extra proud of them. Why would they recommend Dante, when they have "Cantar del Mío Cid"? A Shakespeare translation or original Cervantes? Mark Twain or Benito Pérez Galdós?

I don't mean that non spanish authors are worse (I dislike many of them because they were forced to me too early, when I preferred Dahl or Tolkien), I am just saying that it makes no sense to recommend Shakespeare instead of Cervantes in Spanish Literature class, where they recommend/require books. I can't imagine Russian Literature teachers requiring "Episodios Nacionales" authored by Galdós, a book about spanish history/politics in the XIX century over any russian author about any russian theme.

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#93
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would it not? Divine Comedy and Jack London were both required reading in my Ukrainian school (in translation of course). So was tolstoevsky unfortunately.

Why unfortunately? Tolstoy and Dostoevky are generally recognized as great authors. Being Russian does not make them retrospectively Putinist, does it?

Well, War and Peace is 1200 pages... fuck that at age 15 or whatever XD

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#95
post #54

The original article is comparing "a 2023 study showing that only 16% of Americans read for pleasure in a given day, down from the (already low) number of 28% in 2004" with "the percentage of the overall Spanish population that reads for pleasure has increased every year since 2017, reaching 66% in 2025". I think a big part of the discrepancy probably comes from the different time frames. If you ask somebody who read…

Like DAU vs MAU

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#96
post #64

Spanish is one of the smallest languages in the world at ~93k words. Most languages have hundreds of thousands, English has over a million. Spanish is also nearly phonetic. It's very simple, there's only a few ways to express yourself in Spanish compared to other languages. Overall, it's one of the easiest languages to master.

The only thing you're right about here is that Spanish is "nearly phonetic" by which you mean that the writing system is orthographically transparent and very standardized. That's true and a huge benefit for learners. The rest is not right, the word counts in particular is just a reflection of why counting words in a language is hard: 93k comes from the number headwords listed in the core RAE dictionary. The RAE's di…

Using your figures:

93k (Spanish) to 171k English

or

300k+ (Spanish) to 1M+ English

the original point still stands.

> "there's only a few ways to express yourself in Spanish compared to other languages." is very wrong. Spanish word order is massively more flexible than English

I remain unconvinced here. Spanish love song lyrics have no choice but to invoke "corazon" and "amor" so often because there are so few other words that convey that precise emotion. There are other ways (thinking of the song "Amor de Loca Juventud" by Buena Vista Social Club - beautiful song), but not many other ways like there are in say French, Swedish, or English, to use a few examples. This is mathematically proven to be true by word count alone - which you admit is a far lower figure in Spanish vs other languages.

It doesn't diminish anything about the Spanish language to point this out either, if anything, it makes it more quaint.

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#97

Spanish is one of the smallest languages in the world at ~93k words. Most languages have hundreds of thousands, English has over a million. Spanish is also nearly phonetic. It's very simple, there's only a few ways to express yourself in Spanish compared to other languages. Overall, it's one of the easiest languages to master.

> Overall, it's one of the easiest languages to master.

I'm with you on almost everything else, but the fact that it is such an unwieldy, awkward language means that a ton of communication is by idiom (that just has to be memorized, that's where a lot of the "vocabulary" is), and an enormous amount is allowed to be assumed and left unsaid (aggressively "pro-drop.") Also, the fact that sentence word order is just conventional in Spanish as opposed to strict like Germanic languages or French means that you can do whatever you want with it with the same literal meaning but giving a different connotative impression. Spanish is a great language for poetry but a bad language for communication. Extremely expressive, but not as expressive through the means of vocabulary choices.

The fact that in English you can't just move the words around for emphasis or association means that we need more words, but the fact that our words aren't mutating a fraction as much in order to indicate their function, instead using position, means that any sound put into a particular position will serve that position's function. You can just quack like a duck for the verb, and let people figure out what that noise means the subject is doing. If ducks used the Roman alphabet, English would also just accept the duck spelling without changing it, and use the fact that you don't know how duck words are pronounced as a class marker.

But I think (native English-speaking) people vastly underestimate how difficult English is to read and write. Spanish is easy to read, and almost as easy to write. If you spell a word wrong in Spanish, it probably means that you're also saying it wrong. If Spanish is a 2 in reading difficulty and Chinese characters are an 8, English is probably a 6.

I think the people here denying that Spanish is a small language and that English is an absurdly large language are being guided by the "Law of Averages." Languages being smaller or larger isn't an indication of virtue or grace. It makes literacy a nightmare and is used to discriminate by class and region. English has an excessive number of words that duplicate each other, and as a result (and as a German) so many (and a variable number of by region) vowels that a phonetic written English is a pipedream.

English and Spanish have different grammatical and sound characteristics that allow English to take on new vocabulary casually, and allow Spanish to have a vocabulary largely circumscribed by the RAE (w the Mexican supplements [edit: and the unwritten Chilean one.]) Those characteristics also mean that you could teach an adult Spanish illiterate to read well in a month, and for an adult English illiterate it will take years. English (and French, and Portuguese, and Chinese, and Japanese, etc.) are horrible languages for reading and writing.

If say English number bigger than Spanish number, no need get mad.

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#98
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if this is the reason Spain resisted the advent of far right for so long, compared to its European counterparts.

The Spanish Civil War would like to have a word with you, but maybe Franco is part of "the resistance" now.

Franco died in 1975. They clearly mean recently.

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#99

The statistic is total garbage nobody reads books in spain and democracy doesn't have anything to do with that and democracy is not desirable per se but of course it wouldn't need to be stated if the writer wasn't a dogmatic idy0t

As somebody that spends a lot of time in Spain I can confirm people read a lot compared to the US in general. Seeing a bunch of teenagers in a park reading books is very common and even in rural town where I stay elder people are well read

Re: No Spanish reading crisis?

#100

It's not uncommon to see people (and young people) reading on public transport here in Spain. The odd thing is how popular actual paper books are vs. e-readers. Since I got my Kindle in 2015 I haven't read a paper book since. That said, I find it odd that people assume that reading a book is always higher quality than reading the internet etc. - many books are pretty low quality. And if we look at stuff like the PISA…

> That said, I find it odd that people assume that reading a book is always higher quality than reading the internet etc. - many books are pretty low quality. You've received several answers on the "quality" side due to books being harder to create, but I'll cover two more arguments: 1. Nobody's "reading the internet" anymore, especially not on their phones. They're mindlessly scrolling short-form video, either muted…

>Nobody's "reading the internet" anymore

Even as hyperbole it's too extreme.

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