Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

AI is a bad tool

bytecode.news

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 103 posts

Re: AI is a bad tool

#41

Post by n4r9 »

wmichelin wrote: post #18
datakan wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question. People used to enjoy it but lately all I see are people talking about they "no longer have to do it" I see both sides of the argument people endless have over this. I have been hesitant to take a solid position, first because I suck at coding and second because I dont really have a dog in this fight. The only context I have is my friend in…

I enjoy building things. I do not enjoy the act typing out code by hand. > Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question To follow this debate through, to maximize coding enjoyment, shouldn't we be avoiding compilers? They take away a lot of the code we need to write. Frameworks as well?

I don't think the joy of coding comes simply from writing lots of code. It's the act of precisely expressing one's internal thoughts into an physical medium, and watching it take effect. Using AI as an intermediary makes it less enjoyable. It's like a painter telling his speedy assistant what he wants to paint, and reviewing every attempt until it looks like what he was aiming for. Obviously the painter won't find that as fulfilling and meaningful. And a skilled painter probably won't be quite as happy as if they'd done it personally. The act of painting is a primary driver, not just having a finished painting at the end.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#42

Post by hoppp »

datakan wrote: post #16
m_w_ wrote: post #2

I can only imagine that people who say things like: > If you use AI for anything else, and in particularly if you use it to generate code, you're wasting your time. Have not used frontier models in at least a year. It is nearly inconceivable to me that I would ever go back to writing code by hand, in any context. Even if no new model was ever released, the combination of GLM 5.2 and DeepSeek V4 flash is more than suf…

Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question. People used to enjoy it but lately all I see are people talking about they "no longer have to do it" I see both sides of the argument people endless have over this. I have been hesitant to take a solid position, first because I suck at coding and second because I dont really have a dog in this fight. The only context I have is my friend in…

I have a wrist pain from typing a lot. I prefer to generate and then audit. Just make changes one file at a time and then review and commit.

So I go from typing to prompting and reviewing diffs.

There is no way I install an agent on my laptop so I stick to web UI

Re: AI is a bad tool

#43

Post by wmichelin »

datakan wrote: post #22
wmichelin wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I enjoy building things. I do not enjoy the act typing out code by hand. > Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question To follow this debate through, to maximize coding enjoyment, shouldn't we be avoiding compilers? They take away a lot of the code we need to write. Frameworks as well?

Thanks for the honesty and I think I get it. The AI doing the code leap frogs you to a finished product which is the reward. I do worry about craftmanship in that scenario though.

The finished product alone does not have to be the reward. The reward can still be building a great tool, a great application, etc. With AI we can build it 100x faster, freeing us up to think deeper about our test coverage, our design, our scaling, our observability.

There is no excuse for lazy execution using AI, that is, IMO, equivalent to shoddy software engineering. it's just faster and more accessible now. "AI slop" is just poor execution delivered more quickly.

The onus is still on the human in the drivers seat to deliver quality outcomes.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#44

Post by Foobar8568 »

champagnepapi wrote: post #14
m_w_ wrote: post #2

I can only imagine that people who say things like: > If you use AI for anything else, and in particularly if you use it to generate code, you're wasting your time. Have not used frontier models in at least a year. It is nearly inconceivable to me that I would ever go back to writing code by hand, in any context. Even if no new model was ever released, the combination of GLM 5.2 and DeepSeek V4 flash is more than suf…

How are you verifying all the code that's generated? Do you think that verifying properly would take you as much effort as the original implementation would've?

Have you ever worked in a company? Have you ever worked in a F100?

Companies are paying for software, not for owning the code.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#45

Post by adamddev1 »

m_w_ wrote: post #25
adamddev1 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you writing code for end-user applications, or for tools or libraries that other stuff is built with?

Generally end-user applications, depending on how you classify internal tools. I'm generally very happy with the output of Opus 4.X with a moderately structured CLAUDE.md and some investment in detection/avoidance of anti-patterns (Next.js+ts). I imagine that the bitter lesson is true here, and these heuristic guidelines will become increasingly unnecessary w/ smarter models. Library-type work has mostly been side/to…

Thanks for the answer. From what I can see, most people who are enthusiastic and optimistic about AI use are producing end-user apps, internal tools (limited use) or just hobby libraries. The fuzziness may be tolerable on the edges of immediate use.

Creating something that is solid enough for widespread, reliable building is just in another category. And I wish people recognized this distinction more when they say we don't need to look at code anymore.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#46

Post by jwpapi »

datakan wrote: post #16
m_w_ wrote: post #2

I can only imagine that people who say things like: > If you use AI for anything else, and in particularly if you use it to generate code, you're wasting your time. Have not used frontier models in at least a year. It is nearly inconceivable to me that I would ever go back to writing code by hand, in any context. Even if no new model was ever released, the combination of GLM 5.2 and DeepSeek V4 flash is more than suf…

Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question. People used to enjoy it but lately all I see are people talking about they "no longer have to do it" I see both sides of the argument people endless have over this. I have been hesitant to take a solid position, first because I suck at coding and second because I dont really have a dog in this fight. The only context I have is my friend in…

I don’t know but to me it seems a bunch of people should learn proper typing. There is no way in world that AI is faster in solving/writing problems than you are when you can maneuver your idea/vim properly and have proper domain knowledge and mental model of your codebase. I think it’s genuinely 10x as fast. Just on execution and then if you write it you keep mental model, decide details and you don’t lose context.

Like honestly I’m losing my mind, when people claim I haven’t written code in a year. You had the wrong job your whole life and whilst you think you are so frontier now by using agenst your market value is actually decreasing.

Imagine a painter saying, I’m so happy I don’t have to paint anymore. Or a tennis player. I’m so happay that I don’t have to play tennis anymore.

wtf is going on?

Re: AI is a bad tool

#47

Post by bensyverson »

datakan wrote: post #16
m_w_ wrote: post #2

I can only imagine that people who say things like: > If you use AI for anything else, and in particularly if you use it to generate code, you're wasting your time. Have not used frontier models in at least a year. It is nearly inconceivable to me that I would ever go back to writing code by hand, in any context. Even if no new model was ever released, the combination of GLM 5.2 and DeepSeek V4 flash is more than suf…

Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question. People used to enjoy it but lately all I see are people talking about they "no longer have to do it" I see both sides of the argument people endless have over this. I have been hesitant to take a solid position, first because I suck at coding and second because I dont really have a dog in this fight. The only context I have is my friend in…

There are certain things I enjoy coding by hand, in exactly the same way I like using a manual coffee grinder. Coding can be enjoyable.

But most of the time coding is a means to an end. I bet your friend in HVAC was not told to use a manual drill to have a deeper understanding of how to make holes for installation. AI is simply a power tool.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#48

Post by Rusky »

wmichelin wrote: post #18
datakan wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question. People used to enjoy it but lately all I see are people talking about they "no longer have to do it" I see both sides of the argument people endless have over this. I have been hesitant to take a solid position, first because I suck at coding and second because I dont really have a dog in this fight. The only context I have is my friend in…

I enjoy building things. I do not enjoy the act typing out code by hand. > Do you not enjoy coding? I'm not trying to be snarky, just a genuine question To follow this debate through, to maximize coding enjoyment, shouldn't we be avoiding compilers? They take away a lot of the code we need to write. Frameworks as well?

Compilers don't take away the code we need to write; they translate it into a different formal language that emphasizes and de-emphasizes various aspects of its meaning.

LLMs are categorically a different thing. Instead of soundly translating between formal languages, they adjust how you interact with the formal language.

The enjoyment people get from coding has absolutely nothing to do with the pure volume of code they produce, to the point that this has long been a cliche!

Re: AI is a bad tool

#49

Post by devin »

adamddev1 wrote: post #5
m_w_ wrote: post #2

I can only imagine that people who say things like: > If you use AI for anything else, and in particularly if you use it to generate code, you're wasting your time. Have not used frontier models in at least a year. It is nearly inconceivable to me that I would ever go back to writing code by hand, in any context. Even if no new model was ever released, the combination of GLM 5.2 and DeepSeek V4 flash is more than suf…

Are you writing code for end-user applications, or for tools or libraries that other stuff is built with?

Judging by parent's CV, it kind of looks like they are relatively new to the industry and working in areas where they are heavy on the greenfield side of the equation. I get the sense that they've probably had some good success on smallish projects where they are in charge of keeping it all in their head. That's not to say that isn't earned or otherwise valuable experience, but it surely is not the way a lot of software projects are situated. Parent: I hope you won't take my comment here as a slight. I mean no offense, just pointing out what I think is probably valuable context.

Re: AI is a bad tool

#50

Post by Foobar8568 »

samuelknight wrote: post #17

Has the author used an LLM to brainstorm architecture, explore trade-offs, challenge assumptions, or refine a design? Models are not just 'a data distiller'. "How could I implement X feature in Y project?" requires systematic planning. The agentic paradigm is about balancing (expensive) human and (cheap) machine cognition. Frontier models chew through requirements and if you don't like what they come up with you can…

I am really annoying by these post (not yours, but op), they are basically the reverse of linkedin.

Between LinkedIn that is packed with AI slope, and HN which is "I am smarter than you, AI is awful"...Where are the interesting news?

Post reply on HN