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Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

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Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#131

Post by ryandrake »

Grombobulous wrote: post #67
Gigachad wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don’t agree. Especially in this day where anyone, or any business could run it all through AI and profile everyone to work out the exact best moment to send you a push notification for a Big Mac or whatever.

And this is the perfect demonstration of what why police shouldn’t have access to this technology. Police should be made to get out of their cars and make some relationships with the community to get information. They should be so trusted by the community that private citizens willingly give them tips and security footage to aid investigations. This surveillance tech is a band-aid on the effects of crime rather than…

> Police should be made to get out of their cars and make some relationships with the community to get information. They should be so trusted by the community that private citizens willingly give them tips and security footage to aid investigations.

Police should be part of the community they are policing, not some invading force brought in and hovering over it. When the police live in the same place they are policing and know that community as neighbors, they'll treat it like home and not like some battlefield that they were shipped to, to fight enemies.

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#132

Post by ryandrake »

scottlamb wrote: post #77

> In its statement, the SFPD notes that it adheres to a “strict policy” around drone use, and that “drones can only be used to assist with active criminal investigations, to assist with or in lieu of vehicle pursuits, and for training exercises.” In principle I think this is good. These are useful tools as shown in the first video, helping them safely arrest a suspected thief. And having a policy like this is a good…

Yea, "adheres to a strict policy" could mean anything. They have policies[1] posted publicly. I wonder if any of the footage will be found to violate their policies, and if so, what accountability looks like.

1: https://www.sanfranciscopolice.org/your-sfpd/explore-departm...

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#133

Post by cherry_tree »

rayiner wrote: post #82
cebert wrote: post #8

With mass drone surveillance and online safety acts, we will finally be able to keep our children truly safe for the small cost of privacy.

[flagged]

“The state should replace community” is an interesting take. What other powers should be added to the state? Should they cook our food too? Do you think there’s any downside to the government having these powers?

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#135

Post by JohnFen »

rayiner wrote: post #82
cebert wrote: post #8

With mass drone surveillance and online safety acts, we will finally be able to keep our children truly safe for the small cost of privacy.

[flagged]

There is a tremendous difference between residents being aware of what's happening in their community and mass governmental surveillance.

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#136

Post by rayiner »

ceejayoz wrote: post #123
rayiner wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also remember that I was speaking in the context of the wealthiest country on earth. We could perhaps assume that Brazil may not have the resources to end poverty and crime, but the USA definitely does. That doesn't matter. If crime is caused by poverty, like you hypothesize, then poor countries like Bangladesh should have astronomical crime rates. But they don't.

https://travel.state.gov/en/international-travel/travel-advi... > Travel advisory - People's Republic of Bangladesh: Level 3 - Reconsider travel And a little spot of Level 4: > Do not travel to the Chittagong Hill Tracts due to unrest, crime, terrorism, and kidnapping. This area includes Khagrachari, Rangamati, and Bandarban Hill Tracts districts. Do not travel to this area for any reason.

The travel advisory is because people overthrew the government recently, which is a different problem than the ordinary crime we're talking about. And the Chittagong Hill Tracts are the Bangladeshi equivalent of Indian reservations. Neither supports the contention that poverty causes crime.

The homicide rate across Bangladesh is just over 2.0 per 100k. That's only a bit higher than Canada, a vastly richer country.

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#137

Post by JohnFen »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #28
inigyou wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Scale. The possibility of surveillance was far less worrying when three police officers had to tail you, because they'd only expend that effort when they were pretty sure you'd done a crime.

So we'd rather a high speed chase, crashes, danger to cyclists and pedestrians? I'd rather a drone follows the car until it stops and the police arrive to retrieve it and give a hand slap to the offender. I know this is lagging, and American culture will take decades to accept it, but the better our police are the lighter the sentences can be. Part of why a big hard sentence was seen as a deterrent was sort of the ER…

I would rather live on my feet in a dangerous world than live on my knees in a safe one.

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#138

Post by TimorousBestie »

cherry_tree wrote: post #133
rayiner wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

“The state should replace community” is an interesting take. What other powers should be added to the state? Should they cook our food too? Do you think there’s any downside to the government having these powers?

> Should they cook our food too?

Unironically, also GP: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=46559004

> > The bad food is a plus. The most orderly civilizations generally have the blandest food. Almost all societies with good food are chaotic and disorderly.

So yes, the state should probably take over cooking to maintain order!

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#139

Post by ceejayoz »

rayiner wrote: post #136
ceejayoz wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://travel.state.gov/en/international-travel/travel-advi... > Travel advisory - People's Republic of Bangladesh: Level 3 - Reconsider travel And a little spot of Level 4: > Do not travel to the Chittagong Hill Tracts due to unrest, crime, terrorism, and kidnapping. This area includes Khagrachari, Rangamati, and Bandarban Hill Tracts districts. Do not travel to this area for any reason.

The travel advisory is because people overthrew the government recently, which is a different problem than the ordinary crime we're talking about. And the Chittagong Hill Tracts are the Bangladeshi equivalent of Indian reservations. Neither supports the contention that poverty causes crime. The homicide rate across Bangladesh is just over 2.0 per 100k. That's only a bit higher than Canada, a vastly richer country.

> The travel advisory is because people overthrew the government recently, which is a different problem than the ordinary crime we're talking about.

It feels like that's a tiny challenge to your thesis.

> The homicide rate across Bangladesh is just over 2.0 per 100k. That's only a bit higher than Canada, a vastly richer country.

One wonders if their homicide investigatory capabilities are comparable enough to compare such stats.

Re: Leak of San Francisco Police Drone Footage Exposes Reality of Urban Surveillance

#140

Post by malfist »

Neil44 wrote: post #20
malfist wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"

Is it essential liberty to be able to run around doing crime without being surveiled?

> run around doing crime

This is begging the question. You have not established that someone being surveilled by drones is engaged in crime.

You are absolutely giving up privacy (essential liberty) for security in these cases. Drone cameras don't stop observing just because you're in your backyard, or in your house, or in a private area.

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