How we can reduce traffic congestion • Hacker News Board

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#201

Post by matwood » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:10 AM UTC

collabs wrote: post #61

antiframe wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best way is to change our communities, even if that takes time and money.

It is difficult for me to admit I'm an idiot but when I was younger and living in an apartment, I loved the idea of a single family home. And now that I'm living in a single family home, I feel like I was wrong all along. Not that I want to go back to the apartment I was in before. Dear lord no but the idea of a mixed use building not too tall only like first floor with high ceilings for business or shops with two or…

People also change and want different things at different parts of their life. Young and single - living in an apartment is amazing. Once someone is coupled up, has kids, and some animals, a SFH also looks much more appealing. Once the kids are gone, then an apartment/condo starts to look pretty attractive again.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#202

Post by Tade0 » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:22 AM UTC

trymas wrote: post #172

ChadNauseam wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We definitely need more metro, trams, bus routes, and bike paths. I especially want the latter because I bike to and from work every day. However, I have to wonder about the cost of these projects. In SF, we recently spent $346 million on the Van Ness Improvement Project, which added 2 miles of bus lanes. I just can't see how that's a good use of funds. If someone gave me $346 million and told me to improve society,…

One of the problems indeed. Though IMHO it's just lack of political will. Highways are built at (relative) ease, no matter the cost. Data centers are infamously now being built at society expense (electricity and water capacity), sometimes literally in peoples backyards. At the moment I don't have the receipts, but from anecdotes - it's all just political will. There's a highway extension? Some properties are taken b…

> Highways are built at (relative) ease, no matter the cost.

It's like that because it's a misconception that highways are built for passenger cars. They're built for freight and all kinds of business activities - regular people using them are just a bonus.

The majority of petroleum-based fuel, wear and tear on the highways and toll revenue comes from everything but passenger cars on highways.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#203

Post by ErroneousBosh » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:22 AM UTC

asdff wrote: post #136

xnx wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is driving subsidized?

Massive ongoing investment into roads. EV incentives that would pay for 3-4 ebikes outright. Big 3 bailout. Cash for clunkers. Impact fees from developers towards roads. As others said parking requirements. There is so much beyond that too.

> Massive ongoing investment into roads

Okay, let's stop spending money on roads then.

How are you at riding your bike through mud? Pretty good? Got nice chunky tyres?

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#204

Post by aqme28 » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:33 AM UTC

sndgndgndgndy wrote: post #197

aqme28 wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're completely wrong on safety. Driving is much much more dangerous than trains by orders of magnitude. I know what you're getting at when you write safety, but I want to be clear that this is not the same thing as safety.

Assertions made without evidence can be disregarded without evidence, and your assertion does not match my personal experience. Public transit is dangerous, especially in cities like SF or Seattle.

Oh don’t worry there is plenty of evidence

Deaths per billion miles via

car: 7.3 Train: 0.43

From https://www.vox.com/2015/5/14/8606195/train-safety-driving-c... but you can just google, there are tons of other studies.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#205

Post by sndgndgndgndy » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:37 AM UTC

aqme28 wrote: post #204

sndgndgndgndy wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assertions made without evidence can be disregarded without evidence, and your assertion does not match my personal experience. Public transit is dangerous, especially in cities like SF or Seattle.

Oh don’t worry there is plenty of evidence Deaths per billion miles via car: 7.3 Train: 0.43 From https://www.vox.com/2015/5/14/8606195/train-safety-driving-c... but you can just google, there are tons of other studies.

[dead]

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#206

Post by simondotau » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:38 AM UTC

trymas wrote: post #156

How we can reduce traffic congestion? 1. Extensive support of public transport: metro, tram, dedicated bus routes (separate from car traffic), dedicated paths for bicycles. 2. ... maybe whatever is this ... UPDATE: here's a good graph - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_transport#/media/File:P... , i.e. car traffic is often congested because of inherent low passenger bandwith. If google wants to manage traffic as…

People will generally choose whichever mode of transport is most convenient and cost-effective, based on how they rationally (or irrationally) weigh various factors. If every road were free of traffic, every destination had unlimited parking at the door, everyone already owned a car, and driving carried no direct or indirect costs, almost everyone would drive everywhere.

The only way to shift people onto public transport is to make it more attractive than driving. That can be done by making driving less convenient or more expensive—through higher ownership, fuel, and parking costs, and by resisting attempts to eliminate congestion. And by making public transport better through greater frequency, reliability, coverage, and convenience.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#207

Post by bluGill » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:44 AM UTC

spacemanspiffii wrote: post #195

trymas wrote: post #156

How we can reduce traffic congestion? 1. Extensive support of public transport: metro, tram, dedicated bus routes (separate from car traffic), dedicated paths for bicycles. 2. ... maybe whatever is this ... UPDATE: here's a good graph - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_transport#/media/File:P... , i.e. car traffic is often congested because of inherent low passenger bandwith. If google wants to manage traffic as…

I would add to the top of that list - reducing the distance people travel. Less kilometers would be very effective. Don't spend hours a day in your car. If people wouldn't be traveling so much, especially for work, this whole problem would disappear.

The whole point of a city is all the destinations you can teach. Less km means you can go less places. No density isn't an answer, because some destinations are not dense, and even if they are we can cram more places in.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#208

Post by bluGill » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:48 AM UTC

ChadNauseam wrote: post #165

fragmede wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, how would you spend $346 million?

If we had to stick to transportation-specific improvements, I would use the money to eliminate bus fare for a year. (muni generates about $100M in fare, so really it would be enough money to eliminate fare for ~3 years.) Unlike subway fare, bus fare doesn't prevent n'er-do-wells from getting on the bus (they just ignore the fare and get on anyway), and it probably increases ridership and gets some people out of their…

Why not use the money to make bus service better? There is no city that can't effectively use many more buses. Bus riders all put service as their biggest problem over the cost.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#209

Post by bitter_michael » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:53 AM UTC

bravoetch wrote: post #25

wxw wrote: post #20

> For this study, the Google Maps algorithm was modified to prefer alternative routes with similar travel times and segment types, effectively guiding trips away from the pre-selected congested segments > Over a six month period, we adopted a city-wide switchback (also known as crossover) experimental design, alternating between this treatment and the control (unaltered) routing algorithm over consecutive days to app…

I read the article and didn't see anywhere if they collaborated with city planners, or just ran this on their own. I get the techno-optimism of making traffic 'better' and also it may be concerning if trucks are being routed through neighborhoods where planners didn't build for it.

I had a similar question and am generally curious if google has an internal IRB or equivalent for these studies. Given their outsized influence, there is a reasonable chance of uncoordinated interaction between their efforts and other ongoing studies. For a trivial example, consider interaction between google maps rerouting experiment near an event and localized uber surge pricing.

Re: How we can reduce traffic congestion

#210

Post by gblargg » Mon, Jul 13, 2026, 9:53 AM UTC

ventana wrote: post #49

The same things keeps happening every time I find myself stuck in traffic on the interstate. Out of nowhere, a popup appears in Google Maps: a faster route is available! 4 minutes faster! Unless either the passenger or the driver are fast enough to hit "No thanks", the change auto-applies, and Google now wants me to exit the interstate at the nearest exit and drive some random road I had no idea about, to rejoin the…

Yes, I find it ironic that Google is recommending that people take varied routes, when it's their very app that often puts a bunch of people on an obscure, same route. Many times I've taken one of its shortcuts, only to see a bunch of cars in front of me and behind me taking the same shortcut, clearly not one people would normally take.