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I Learned to Read Again

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Re: I Learned to Read Again

#21

Post by pseudonymidy »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #12
pseudonymidy wrote: post #7

Is there value in identifying the difference between reading a longer article like this one and an actual book? Reading the news from the AP/Reuters and a book on history? I spend lots of time online, primarily on my phone, reading. I don’t watch videos and I don’t use social media aside from browsing the Reddit front page. I try to justify my online escapes because I’m reading a substack, a bit of news, an interesti…

> Is there value in identifying the difference between reading a longer article like this one and an actual book? Almost every study that looks at this finds that there is. Between the time for deeper contemplation, cognitive load of sustained attention and greater potential information content of a larger body of text compared with a smaller one, someone who reads books is generally going to more competently underst…

I’m not familiar with the research but I will say that conclusion “feels” right to me.

Have they found a modern day metric that we should all be hunting in our quest for reading health? A literary equivalent to the daily 10,000 steps?

Maybe 10,000 words!

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#22

Post by JumpCrisscross »

BoingBoomTschak wrote: post #20
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is reading morally superior? No. Of course not. Someone who can't read due to mental disability isn't morally inferior to someone who can and does.

He obviously meant "is choosing to spend your time reading morally superior" , though.

> He obviously meant "is choosing to spend your time reading morally superior", though

Sure. I'm answering it by another measure. Killing is, ceteris paribus, morally inferior to not killing. I'd argue a psychopath is henceforth morally debilitated despite it not really being their "fault" that they're born without empathy. This, in turn, helps me conclude that a murderer is, in fact, doing wrong.

Same here. Someone who can't read isn't inherently less morally capable than someone who can. What reading gives one is the capacity to gain a better understanding of ethics and morals. So I'd guess folks who read books are, on average, more intelligent and at least seeking to conduct themselves in a more moral fashion than someone who doesn't. But that doesn't make spending time reading morally superior to some other activity.

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#23

Post by JumpCrisscross »

pseudonymidy wrote: post #21
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is there value in identifying the difference between reading a longer article like this one and an actual book? Almost every study that looks at this finds that there is. Between the time for deeper contemplation, cognitive load of sustained attention and greater potential information content of a larger body of text compared with a smaller one, someone who reads books is generally going to more competently underst…

I’m not familiar with the research but I will say that conclusion “feels” right to me. Have they found a modern day metric that we should all be hunting in our quest for reading health? A literary equivalent to the daily 10,000 steps? Maybe 10,000 words!

There is also a weird, robust mortality relationship where book readers live longer than periodical readers "regardless of gender, health, wealth, or education" [1]. In those studies, the threshold was 30 minutes of book reading a day.

[1] https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5105607/

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#24

Post by sowbug »

pseudonymidy wrote: post #21
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is there value in identifying the difference between reading a longer article like this one and an actual book? Almost every study that looks at this finds that there is. Between the time for deeper contemplation, cognitive load of sustained attention and greater potential information content of a larger body of text compared with a smaller one, someone who reads books is generally going to more competently underst…

I’m not familiar with the research but I will say that conclusion “feels” right to me. Have they found a modern day metric that we should all be hunting in our quest for reading health? A literary equivalent to the daily 10,000 steps? Maybe 10,000 words!

Ten thousand books in an 80-year lifetime would mean finishing one book every three days. That's aggressive, but entirely achievable.

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#25

Post by buzzwords »

Interesting, I struggle to read. I always have. But I genuinely enjoyed it. Few years back I told a colleague that by the time I reach the end of paragraph I forget how it started. He told me sounds like a learning difficulty. So I did a test, thinking I was dyslexic. It turns out I have ADHD with particularly bad short term memory. Anyways my question for everyone here, how do you read with ADHD? How do you over come reading the same passage multiple time?

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#26

Post by colechristensen »

buzzwords wrote: post #25

Interesting, I struggle to read. I always have. But I genuinely enjoyed it. Few years back I told a colleague that by the time I reach the end of paragraph I forget how it started. He told me sounds like a learning difficulty. So I did a test, thinking I was dyslexic. It turns out I have ADHD with particularly bad short term memory. Anyways my question for everyone here, how do you read with ADHD? How do you over com…

Audiobooks sped up to ~2x or so, but you usually have to build up to that speed.

There are also exercises which help develop short term memory like n-back training for which there are many phone apps.

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#27

Post by buzzwords »

colechristensen wrote: post #26
buzzwords wrote: post #25

Interesting, I struggle to read. I always have. But I genuinely enjoyed it. Few years back I told a colleague that by the time I reach the end of paragraph I forget how it started. He told me sounds like a learning difficulty. So I did a test, thinking I was dyslexic. It turns out I have ADHD with particularly bad short term memory. Anyways my question for everyone here, how do you read with ADHD? How do you over com…

Audiobooks sped up to ~2x or so, but you usually have to build up to that speed. There are also exercises which help develop short term memory like n-back training for which there are many phone apps.

Oh you don't zone out?

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#28

Post by loughnane »

> I hit my reading peak when I was eleven or twelve.

This has long been the way. Mortimer Adler pointed out in the 70s (at the latest) that reading instruction (ie how to extract meaning from marks on a page) doesn’t really advance after 6th grade. After that we still give kids harder things to read, but scarcely provide them with strategies.

His How to read a book was an attempt at filling in the gap. It’s one of my favorite books.

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#29

Post by Yizahi »

justincarter wrote: post #13

Is reading morally superior? It seems like greater society (with the apps) is rapidly changing back to an oral culture which seems to be humanity’s default setting. Edit - via the visual boost of short form video

For a long time learning required a primary attention of a person. Usually a monopoly attention. You can't read printed text and do something else in parallel (fidgeting doesn't count). Radio and TV facilitated background viewing and listening but there weren't many options to personalize those. And then IT revolution happened and humanity discovered that they can do something as a primary attention task and "learn" in background by listening to a narrated educational media. And with the invention of speed-up, those people are now debating is x2 speed-up too slow, and just how fast can they go while still discerning words.

it's my personal hot-take, but I think that a majority of those background listeners are doing performative "learning" and aren't learning anything really. It's just to brag once a year that they have "read" 100+ books in a year and post a wall of covers or a number on their social network feed.

Basically, books aren't morally superior media than anything else really. But focused and monopoly attention dedicated to some media is morally superior to a performative background "learning". Books simply eliminate even a possibility of reading them in background.

Re: I Learned to Read Again

#30

Post by colechristensen »

loughnane wrote: post #28

> I hit my reading peak when I was eleven or twelve. This has long been the way. Mortimer Adler pointed out in the 70s (at the latest) that reading instruction (ie how to extract meaning from marks on a page) doesn’t really advance after 6th grade. After that we still give kids harder things to read, but scarcely provide them with strategies. His How to read a book was an attempt at filling in the gap. It’s one of my…

My favorite part of How to Read a Book is how it classifies books into books worth skimming over, books worth reading each word exactly once, and books worith studying and actively engaging with in depth.

How to Read a Book is definitely worth skimming, but it is quite repetitive and filled with unnecessary volume. It would get the job done at 1/10th the length.

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