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Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

smithsonianmag.com

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Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#51

Post by gertop »

flaunf221 wrote: post #48
louky wrote: post #11

The major proponent was also known as Thomas Midgley Jr.: Accidentally The Most Dangerous Man Who Ever Lived[0] Leaded gas, CFCs, and accidentally created a machine that ended his own existence.[1] [0] https://allthatsinteresting.com/thomas-midgley-jr [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Midgley_Jr .

> The Most Dangerous Man Who Ever Lived The titles like annoy me to no end. Because Thomas Midgley was an engineer. Not overlord of General Motors. Not director. Not even a large shaholder. GM Leadership knew effects of TEL. And for decades traded everyone's health for their profits. Midgley is complicit, but he's just a small piece.

People who absolve engineers of all responsibility annoy me to no end. They're omnipresent on this forum and justify working for Facebook with things like "not my decision" or "someone else would do it" or "it's not that bad you just don't understand" or "I'm just following orders"

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#52

Post by sysguest »

mmooss wrote: post #38
cyberax wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think he really appreciated the danger of lead. Its acute toxicity was well-known, but not its chronic toxicity. And plenty of stuff is toxic in large quantities but harmless (or even vital!) in small quantities.

Interesting - what is that based on? He's not some incidental commentator. He's an engineer and a principle force behind this technology. He is responsible for the outcomes - 'I didn't know' is reckless negligence. And if there were clear acute problems, chronic problems weren't hard to guess at for anyone, much less an engineer, with all those resources, working on it for years.

> engineer and a principle force behind this technology

well he's not some biochemist...

and even biochemists have trouble within their own field because there's so much 'unknown' stuff in biochem (eg Thalidomide scandal)

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#53

Post by jghn »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #9

Same with cigarettes and asbestos. Everyone knew smokers had shorter lives, but the facts were suppressed because it was inconvenient. Everyone knew asbestos was dangerous, but they put it in every single house for decades because "fire was worse". And don't even get me started on DDT and teflon.

Asbestos gets a bit of a bad rap. There's an enormous difference from e.g. asbestos tiles and siding in a house vs loose clumps of insulation at mass scale in large factories and such.

But at some point people decided that any asbestos was an immediate ticket to mesothelioma and had to eradicate it altogether.

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#54

Post by hyperhello »

gertop wrote: post #51
flaunf221 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Most Dangerous Man Who Ever Lived The titles like annoy me to no end. Because Thomas Midgley was an engineer. Not overlord of General Motors. Not director. Not even a large shaholder. GM Leadership knew effects of TEL. And for decades traded everyone's health for their profits. Midgley is complicit, but he's just a small piece.

People who absolve engineers of all responsibility annoy me to no end. They're omnipresent on this forum and justify working for Facebook with things like "not my decision" or "someone else would do it" or "it's not that bad you just don't understand" or "I'm just following orders"

People who say annoy me to no end annoy me no end. They’re different phrases.

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#55

Post by whatisthiseven »

cyberax wrote: post #34
mmooss wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Accidentally Based on the OP, it wasn't at all accidental. They knew it was dangerous and chose it because they could make more money than with safer alternatives such as ethanol.

I don't think he really appreciated the danger of lead. Its acute toxicity was well-known, but not its chronic toxicity. And plenty of stuff is toxic in large quantities but harmless (or even vital!) in small quantities.

Then you don't know anything about the man. He intentionally inhaled large quantities of leaded gas to prove it was safe to on lockers.

He would then spend months in Florida recovering from lead poisoning.

He knew, and he didn't care.

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#56

Post by tux3 »

hyperhello wrote: post #54
gertop wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who absolve engineers of all responsibility annoy me to no end. They're omnipresent on this forum and justify working for Facebook with things like "not my decision" or "someone else would do it" or "it's not that bad you just don't understand" or "I'm just following orders"

People who say annoy me to no end annoy me no end. They’re different phrases.

That's ironic, because the "no end" form was already a relatively new idiom. But "to no end" has already overtaken it in terms of popularity. Of course I meant the word "ironic" like I mean the word "literally"; which is to say, figuratively.

Being a prescriptivist creates no end of everyday pains. Language just won't conform.

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#57

Post by cyanydeez »

Epa095 wrote: post #12
cyanydeez wrote: post #4

i'm fairly certain the reason trump was elected is the long tail of leaded gasoline; the timing fits pretty well.

Why did these same people vote differently earlier? Does the effect of leaded gasoline show up later in life? And does not explain all the young men voting for him.

there's no "same people"; leaded gasoline was phased out in the 80's but wasn't finished until around 2000s.

The elderly are simply more engaged and that's what happened.

Re: Leaded gas was a known poison the day it was invented (2016)

#59

Post by hyperhello »

tux3 wrote: post #56
hyperhello wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who say annoy me to no end annoy me no end. They’re different phrases.

That's ironic, because the "no end" form was already a relatively new idiom. But "to no end" has already overtaken it in terms of popularity. Of course I meant the word "ironic" like I mean the word "literally"; which is to say, figuratively. Being a prescriptivist creates no end of everyday pains. Language just won't conform.

The thing is that it’s always used in “annoy” or “frustrate” because they mistake the response as sympathetic annoyance or empathic frustration when it’s really just their misuse of language. I don’t want them to be responsible for their miscommunication in the future!
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