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Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

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Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#101

Post by Karunamon »

king_jester wrote: post #72
hdra wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. Although I agree with his view for free software, the way he convey his messages smells too much of fanaticism for me to swallow.

So you dismiss RMS's arguments just because he doesn't talk and write the way you think he should? Talk about derailment, by this logic you don't have to agree with anyone or anything just as long as you feel they aren't nice or polite or well spoken enough.

just because he doesn't talk and write the way you think he should

If he can't communicate his ideas in a calm and balanced way, perhaps those ideas don't have as much value as he thinks they do. Sorry, but method of delivery counts for a lot.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#102

Post by Surio »

harel wrote: post #66

You can always turn it off. You can always use Gnome Shell over Unity (should anyway as its nicer). You can always buy another operating system. You know, vote with your wallet. Ah, wait... There has to be a price for free. In RMS world everybody is a hacker, everything is free (as in love) and open and nobody needs to eat, kids grow up not costing a penny. But in my world, I understand that sometimes I'm getting som…

>>> I'm getting something for free that is actually superior to the paid stuff, and sometimes those giving it to me need to feed a kid or two, or buy their Mrs that new outfit on the high street.

Classy. You get my vote for that and subsequently pointing out that "They don't even force me to do it because I can turn it off". This.

I also liked the way you ended it. We definitely need RMS, but he definitely needs to choose his battles wisely.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#103

Post by chipaca »

curiousdannii wrote: post #56
justinf wrote: post #18

I'd guess that the only way to really dislodge the Amazon widget would be to make sure it remains unprofitable. If it remains a major talking point and doesn't pull in enough money to compensate for its negative effect on community evangelism, it won't last long. I have mixed feelings about the new system. On the one hand, I respect a lot of what Canonical is doing with linux regarding mainstreaming, streamlining, an…

Amazon postage is prohibitively expensive for those outside the US (except perhaps for those who live in another country where Amazon is based?) The only time I'd ever use Amazon is if I'm after an old rare book which is out of print and Amazon is the only place I can find a second hand copy. And in those times I'd actually be deliberately searching for it, checking many sites in my browser, not casually using Unity!

We only query amazon if you are in a country that has a local amazon store.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#104

Post by willvarfar »

antidoh wrote: post #97

What distro would you recommend take the place of Ubuntu, as a recommended for newbs distro? I mean a distro that you would feel comfortable recommending to a stranger that you will not be able to help install or support the distro, as well as the more traditional "lemme help you with that." As a subset of that, what apt based distro would you recommend for that niche? Is plain Debian really something that people fee…

I recommend Xubuntu. And if they run Windows, install it as WUBI.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#105

Post by antidoh »

meaty wrote: post #50

I'm a little surprised at how accepting people are here relating to the Amazon feature in Ubuntu. I would assume that there are a lot of critical thinkers here as comp sci people tend to have that mentality. Possibly not! The usual excuses are "we can turn it off etc" or just shrug it off and carry on. Have you thought long term? If you don't make a stand with this feature, one will eventually be added which can't be…

Indeed.

If spyware is a continuum from onerous to innocuous, then at the moment Canonical's string sending/sharing is somewhere near the innocuous end of the line. But it's still within the continuum.

By excusing it as innocuous and (for now) flippable, we shorten the line.

And then shorten the line again for the next thing that finds itself happily closer to the innocuous end of the line.

And again.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#106

Post by morsch »

btilly wrote: post #84

Canonical is not the first to do this. And nobody minded. In Chrome, every time you start to type a URL, it tries to autocomplete. One source of autocompletions is that it contacts Google, which sends back suggestions. Therefore by default Google knows every search you do in Chrome, even if you didn't want to go to Google. (They turn this off for incognito mode.) I don't know how long this has been the case for Chrom…

Lots of people minded. There was a huge shitstorm when Google introduced it on the search front page, there was one when Firefox enabled it in the search box and there was one when Chrome was released without a separation between the location and search box.

At least the search suggestions are genuinely useful, in stark contrast to the Amazon ads.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#107

Post by chipaca »

drcube wrote: post #31
raverbashing wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, using find and grep won't trigger a network search (unless of course it's on an NFS server or something like that)

They're on it. :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-terminal/+bu...

I hate to point out the obvious, but for people who don't click the link: that bug was filed in irony (and by somebody who didn't "get" the home lens as a global search tool, but that perceptual problem is ours more than it is anybody else's). The global search functionality could be queried from the commandline (by writing a tool that talked to the backends over dbus, as the dash does), and I half expect somebody to implement a kludgy version of "grep" that did exactly that, it is in no way something we're going to ever ship.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#108

Post by Surio »

rlpb wrote: post #91
jfreak53 wrote: post #83

I agree, the Linux community as a whole has never stood for these malfeasons ever!! I say we stand up, I use Ubuntu on ALL my PC's home and work, so we're talking 15 to 20 PC's that I might have to move over to another Distro here soon. This is not the first time Ubuntu has tried these "Windowz" practices on it's users, but this needs to be the last! The first was taking away our choice in the first release of Unity,…

> Ubuntu has been trying to take our choices away for a long, long time. How has it taken any of your choices away? All of Debian is available in Ubuntu, and Debian is all about choice. You can manipulate your systems as you please. You can even roll your own installation CD exactly how you want it. Canonical even supports Xubuntu, Kubuntu, Lubuntu etc., all of which have taken a different set of choices and all of w…

Sigh.... you mean well. But you'll never win this battle/war of words... Someone summed this whole thing on another earlier thread on.... (wait for it......) Ubuntu, a few days ago...

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4864591

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4864615

And the argument continues.....

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#109

Post by belorn »

rimantas wrote: post #88
belorn wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its a very loaded and picturesque description to use, but is it an wrong description? The goal of book burning is to remove information, private owned books in this case, from the public by destroying them. While one could smash them and disintegrate them through the use of massive force, burning was the practical tool used. If kindle suddenly create a goal of removing information from the public, in this case some p…

> doesn't that act align itself perfectly with book burning, > through instead of using fire, they used electronic means If that was the primary purpose of Kindle, you'd be right. However, for that to be true you constructed a scenario which is opposite to the real and intended use of Kindle.

Of course its not the primary purpose of the Kindle to destroy information. They have however made it their goal once before in regard to one book.

The original blog post could be interpreted as claiming what the kindles main purpose is, but I doubt RMS would defend such interpretation. A one time act, while notable, does not equal primary purpose, and he and everyone else knows that.

Re: Ubuntu Spyware: What to Do?

#110

Post by antidoh »

willvarfar wrote: post #104
antidoh wrote: post #97

What distro would you recommend take the place of Ubuntu, as a recommended for newbs distro? I mean a distro that you would feel comfortable recommending to a stranger that you will not be able to help install or support the distro, as well as the more traditional "lemme help you with that." As a subset of that, what apt based distro would you recommend for that niche? Is plain Debian really something that people fee…

I recommend Xubuntu. And if they run Windows, install it as WUBI.

I mean something not derived from Ubuntu.

Yes, Xubuntu (which I currently run underneath XMonad) does not (yet) have this and future related features, and that's good.

But by using an Ubuntu derived distro, you lend credibility to Ubuntu and Canonical.

I would prefer to recommend something higher up the derivation line between Debian and Ubuntu.

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