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Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

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Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend to see far more obvious bots attacking Claude than any other - which makes sense, they're winning.

Same, the main network I see bots on is X and there’s a really obvious bot attack on them there since the fight with the DoD.

Reddit and X are flooded with them.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#522

Some pretty damning stuff: > OpenAI also instructs new hires on how to avoid scrutiny when they leave Apple. For example, Mr. Tan warns them not to tell Apple that they have taken jobs at OpenAI, so they can stay at Apple as long as they can. > Apple says it discovered a pattern of OpenAI recruits emailing themselves confidential information when leaving Apple, including Tan. > OpenAI apparently used confidential App…

Generally speaking, companies retaining a competitive advantage with each other is good for their investors but bad for the public. It's usually to the public's benefit for employees to share knowledge, it makes goods and services cheaper and more available.

Short to medium term yes. However there are arguments to be made that this would significantly stifle innovation longterm.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#524

Some pretty damning stuff: > OpenAI also instructs new hires on how to avoid scrutiny when they leave Apple. For example, Mr. Tan warns them not to tell Apple that they have taken jobs at OpenAI, so they can stay at Apple as long as they can. > Apple says it discovered a pattern of OpenAI recruits emailing themselves confidential information when leaving Apple, including Tan. > OpenAI apparently used confidential App…

Culture issue. From How to Apply to Y Combinator [1] by Paul Graham: "Please tell us about the time you most successfully hacked some (non-computer) system to your advantage." > we’re not looking for the sort of obedient, middle-of-the-road people that big companies tend to hire. We’re looking for people who like to beat the system. 1: https://www.ycombinator.com/howtoapply.html

I think something like "figuring out a way to stack the odds in your favour in a gameshow" would fit that bill, and that seems fairly innocuous to me.

Though full disclosure: I did that, so that might colour my view. https://vincenttunru.com/hacking-a-gameshow/

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#525

Some pretty damning stuff: > OpenAI also instructs new hires on how to avoid scrutiny when they leave Apple. For example, Mr. Tan warns them not to tell Apple that they have taken jobs at OpenAI, so they can stay at Apple as long as they can. > Apple says it discovered a pattern of OpenAI recruits emailing themselves confidential information when leaving Apple, including Tan. > OpenAI apparently used confidential App…

It gets even worse. The person not only kept the laptop and used an exploit to download confidential Apple documents, they bragged about it to a contact who was still working at Apple who was also feeding him information: > Liu allegedly kept an Apple-issued laptop after departing the company and exploited a vulnerability to download dozens of confidential Apple documents while he was working at OpenAI. He also maint…

> This is how you behave when you think you're so much smarter than everyone around you that consequences don't apply to you.

Its also how some folks act like when they've done something they morally can't deal with - their subconscious starts throwing all sorts of obvious signs up until they get caught. I presume this was done for a giant pile of cash, stock, and probably a promise that nobody really cares if you show up or not, enjoy your retirement.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Civil disobedience involves flagrantly and publicly and obviously violating the law so you can be arrested to draw attention to whatever issue you have with the law. If you’re breaking the law and trying to get away with it, that’s just criminality and isn’t honorable or respectable.

Civil disobedience is the breaking of laws your conscience tells you are unjust -- and accepting all possible consequences that come along with such an act. Doesn't mean you have to make it trivial for the consequences to find you by literally walking yourself into jail.

Without the intention of personally profiting from breaking these laws. Which is what these people are doing.

If they released this information publicly then you might have a point.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People do weird things when given sudden access to money or power. It's more that money and power enable you to be who you really are, and amplify your worst traits if you're lacking self-awareness. There are many people who are rich/wealthy and/or powerful and they're decent individuals living relatively ordinary lives. You don't read about most of them because they're "normal".

> It's more that money and power enable you to be who you really are If you’re only a certain way when you have money and power, is it really “who you really are”?

I believe the original statement is an oversimplification. What actually happens is that extreme situations, both positive and negative, can help you discover things about you that you didn't know before.

Apart from that, the problem with "who you really are" is that individual is more of a process than a static thing, so any such reification becomes invalid in the next instant.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#528
post #454

OpenAI is a company built on copyright violation. That means it’s in the corporate DNA to treat laws as things for little people. Apple have deep enough pockets that they can actually sue OpenAI but I bet OpenAI are surprised they got caught. Now ask yourself, would the Codex agents on your machine ever over step legal boundaries? Would OpenAI ever make use of data you, voluntarily, send to their servers? If they did…

Don't matter to people who look at codex as a way to replace employees

Maybe. But those people might care about their IP being stolen by Codex.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If "eliminate all IP law" is your preference then that's fine but it isn't a reason to commit crimes while we have these laws.

We have the laws, but I don't have to feel outraged when regular people undercut the oligarchs and those people's interests align with my own.

It’s other oligarchs using regular people to undercut their competitors while offloading most of the risk to those regular people, though.

Re: Apple sues OpenAI, accuses ex-employees of stealing trade secrets

#530
post #38

A company that behaves like this in one area, cannot be trusted in any area. Any enterprise that endorses/allows OpenAI products to be used is taking a big risk.

The same can be said about Apple. Several companies have complained about them taking a meeting with apple, presenting their product, only to have Apple then rip it off and build it in house. To say nothing of sherlocking.

Presenting a product prototype or idea at a meeting is vastly different from an ex-employee stealing corporate secrets - to me at least.
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