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In Emacs, everything looks like a service

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Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#61

Post by znpy »

masfoobar wrote: post #34
kleiba2 wrote: post #27

I've been an Emacs user for over 25 years. But last year I switched employers and they won't let me use it even for tasks where it would absolutely shine. Their argument is that all team members should use the same tools, and I guess that is a valid point. Unfortunately, I failed to convince my employer to make everybody else switch to Emacs. So, now I'm using lots of one-purpose tools, one for each separate task, a…

At a company I work for, they are doing various changes (and control) over the software we install as we transition to a larger company. I believe they are using Microsoft Intune so they can allow/deny what can be installed. I have not updated my laptop (or got a new one) because I am concerned they will not allow me to install or continue to use Emacs. Honestly, I can vision how that conversation goes:- [manager]: H…

Back in the day when i had a windows laptop for work you could just download the windows binary distribution of emacs and run that, has something changed?

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#62

Post by tvink »

pjmlp wrote: post #48
mananaysiempre wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as you don’t care about interlanguage interop, sure. The opposite point of view, that every language tries to become an operating system (and consequently to prevent other languages from coexisting), is also possible, and I’m somewhat more sympathetic to that one.

That is mostly a non issue on microservices and serverless runtimes running on top of type 1 hypervisors, and bare metal embedded deployments.

I'm unsure why you point this out. It's also a non issue if you're trying to drive a unicycle. Isn't it more interesting to talk about the cases where it applies? Or do you reckon all programs should be microservices?

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#63

Post by bitwize »

kleiba2 wrote: post #40
masfoobar wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At a company I work for, they are doing various changes (and control) over the software we install as we transition to a larger company. I believe they are using Microsoft Intune so they can allow/deny what can be installed. I have not updated my laptop (or got a new one) because I am concerned they will not allow me to install or continue to use Emacs. Honestly, I can vision how that conversation goes:- [manager]: H…

I worked briefly in public administration at one point in my career. I asked the admins the same thing, could I get Emacs installed on my machine. I got a bit concerned when the admin staff asked back: "What is Emacs?"

I was a bit surprised when about ten years ago I noticed that there were now really only two reactions to my Emacs use:

"Emacs? What's that? Oh, sorry, I like things with an actual UI."

Or:

"Emacs? I remember that from my DEC days. I'm surprised it's still around!"

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#64

Post by masfoobar »

znpy wrote: post #61
masfoobar wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At a company I work for, they are doing various changes (and control) over the software we install as we transition to a larger company. I believe they are using Microsoft Intune so they can allow/deny what can be installed. I have not updated my laptop (or got a new one) because I am concerned they will not allow me to install or continue to use Emacs. Honestly, I can vision how that conversation goes:- [manager]: H…

Back in the day when i had a windows laptop for work you could just download the windows binary distribution of emacs and run that, has something changed?

This is what I do when I use Windows. However, in recent years, I tend to use Emacs via WSL.

However, I believe Microsoft Intune is used within the Business to control what software can and cannot be installed. So my guess is Windows won't allow you to install via a typical .exe

I am not suggesting the above is 100% valid. I just don't want to get a new laptop and find out. Maybe I can still use Emacs via WSL... bypassing Intune????

At the end of the day, I understand Security is getting much more serious in recent years - and we even have a dedicated department - but controlling the software to install is crazy, especially for a development team.

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#65

Post by znpy »

deng wrote: post #24

This just proves that you can cram pretty much anything into the client/server dichotomy if you just define "client", "server" and "request" broad enough. Similarly, I remember how desperately people tried to argue that Emacs follows the "Unix philosophy" as long as your LISP functions are doing just one thing, and do them well. I don't know what you would gain from these things. Emacs follows the idea of LISP machin…

> Heck, there's a whole semantic parsing engine buried within (CEDET), which nowadays is pretty much unused

In fairness that used to be common to have in most IDEs.

I don’t know if it’s still the case but i remember that the first java language server was spun off the Eclipse’s java semantic parsing engine.

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#66

Post by tvink »

tom_alexander wrote: post #35
wtetzner wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Their argument is that all team members should use the same tools, and I guess that is a valid point. Why is that a valid point?

In my case, I am a very senior member of my team so 25-50% of each day is spent helping and/or teaching teammates. In situations like that, it is useful to be deeply familiar with the tools that your teammates are using so you can tell them exactly what to do. For example, if I'm teaching a new hire to set up their vscode it is not very helpful to tell them "now you need to activate the python venv". It is much more…

Idunno. I think you end up teaching them nothing and just doing it for them. I mentor plenty folks without learning more than basics of vscode/cursor, and the most important lesson for them is always how to figure out how to do stuff (which has never been easier than today).

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#67

Post by SoftTalker »

rozularen wrote: post #59
SoftTalker wrote: post #58

Emacs itself can run as a client and server. To start the server: emacs --daemon Then use `emacsclient` to connect to it. All `emacsclient` instances whether in terminals or GUI are using the same server and can access the same open files and buffers. Unfortunately it only works locally. I've tried to forward the emacs server socket over ssh to a remote client and it doesn't work.

could you see the reason it didn't work?

It's been a number of years, and all I really remember is coming to the conclusion that "emacsclient only works with a local server." It uses a domain socket for this, but forwarding that from a remote server doesn't seem to be enough.

Simply editing a remote file over an ssh connection is easy enough using TRAMP, but that isn't the same as accessing existing buffers in a remote server.

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#68

Post by rglullis »

kleiba2 wrote: post #27

I've been an Emacs user for over 25 years. But last year I switched employers and they won't let me use it even for tasks where it would absolutely shine. Their argument is that all team members should use the same tools, and I guess that is a valid point. Unfortunately, I failed to convince my employer to make everybody else switch to Emacs. So, now I'm using lots of one-purpose tools, one for each separate task, a…

> Their argument is that all team members should use the same tools, and I guess that is a valid point.

Why?! It is a text editor for crying out loud. If you are more productive using the tools you want, don't cost anything to the company and doesn't force your colleagues to adopt your workflow, you could be working with notepad for all I care.

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#69

Post by Arubis »

kleiba2 wrote: post #27

I've been an Emacs user for over 25 years. But last year I switched employers and they won't let me use it even for tasks where it would absolutely shine. Their argument is that all team members should use the same tools, and I guess that is a valid point. Unfortunately, I failed to convince my employer to make everybody else switch to Emacs. So, now I'm using lots of one-purpose tools, one for each separate task, a…

Having everyone on a team have different personalities is managerially inefficient. You have to deal with each team member in a different way instead of being able to have a unified emotional approach. So we required frontal lobotomies for everyone on the team.

Re: In Emacs, everything looks like a service

#70

Post by wtetzner »

tvink wrote: post #66
tom_alexander wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my case, I am a very senior member of my team so 25-50% of each day is spent helping and/or teaching teammates. In situations like that, it is useful to be deeply familiar with the tools that your teammates are using so you can tell them exactly what to do. For example, if I'm teaching a new hire to set up their vscode it is not very helpful to tell them "now you need to activate the python venv". It is much more…

Idunno. I think you end up teaching them nothing and just doing it for them. I mentor plenty folks without learning more than basics of vscode/cursor, and the most important lesson for them is always how to figure out how to do stuff (which has never been easier than today).

Yeah, I kinda feel like when you're mentoring people, you should let them drive. If you're going to do it for them, you might as well just record a training video.
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