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EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

ec.europa.eu

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Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#31

Post by xoac »

Frieren wrote: post #26
whiplash451 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am with you and wish you were right, but good luck forcing Meta to change the key dark design patterns of their products (correctly identified by the regulators as "highly personalised recommendations, autoplay and infinite scroll") This is a step in the right direction, though. It will be a long journey.

> good luck forcing Meta When I was a kid there were fines for factories that polluted water. Most of the time they were not found out, and when they did they just paid the fine that it was cheaper than to solve the problem. Regulations changed, factories that polluted water got closed until they fixed the problem. Most factory owners fear the regulation, they are extremely pro-active to avoid breaking the law becaus…

Exactly. If social media apps had a configurable old style non-algorithmic feed the problem would be dramatically smaller.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#32

Post by jeltz »

delis-thumbs-7e wrote: post #13
carlosjobim wrote: post #3

Nothing was ever said about the addictive design of mainstream TV - because then the rulers controlled the message being streamed into the brains of the population. It is precisely on Facebook and Instagram where you find the only popular movements against the current order in Europe, and the citizen journalists who expose and scrutinize the powers. It's a giant political threat towards those in power. So, how do we…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Not even that, it is just an off-topic rant about government censorship.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#33

Post by pembrook »

This is the same EU commission pushing chat control and VPN bans and passports to access the internet. Which people on HN hate.

Yet, when they couch authoritarian action under the premise of a popular moral panic, suddenly the reaction here is “tie us up and tell us what we’re allowed to see daddy.”

I really don’t get it. Do you not see how cheering on this social media moral panic and inflating the idea of a big tech “boogieman” leads to emboldening them to do the much worse authoritarian surveillance state thing? I guess this is the inherent contradiction of left-leaning internet spaces.

We want privacy and freedom personally but as self-styled members of the urban elite we unironically believe everyone else is dumber than us. So we don’t want other people to have freedom over what they do and read.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#34

Post by salahadawi »

chk84us wrote: post #11

Only tangentailly related, but, there is an option in Instagram to reset your algorithm. I highly recommend this if you find yourself doom-scrolling. Not sure if it's also in FB on account of me not having an account there.

After resetting my algorithm the content I’m served now is even more clickbaity and trying to forcibly hold my attention

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#35

Post by joe_mamba »

pembrook wrote: post #33

This is the same EU commission pushing chat control and VPN bans and passports to access the internet. Which people on HN hate. Yet, when they couch authoritarian action under the premise of a popular moral panic, suddenly the reaction here is “tie us up and tell us what we’re allowed to see daddy.” I really don’t get it. Do you not see how cheering on this social media moral panic and inflating the idea of a big tec…

This is just boiling the frog slowly. The DSA will first get them to change the algorithm to "protect the kids" and years later it will get them to change the algorithm to push state propaganda and ban all hateful speech, which will be anyone who complains about the state and its rulers.

They're playing the long game. First with the carrot, then with the stick, but the end goal is state tyranny, and control over tech platforms is one of the means.

They saw what China managed to achieve with their internet censorship and ID control, and they want exactly that, but with a blue coat of paint sprinkled with yellow stars, and pushing child safety up front is a easy way for the public to be onboard with this capture.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#36

Post by somenameforme »

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #12

Forcing social media apps to have a less addictive design is a much better way to protect young people's brains than a social media age limit is (and frankly adults need help here too).

Social media, even before the era of dark patterns and 'engagement' maximization was still extremely addictive. It just had a less pronounced effect in large part because fewer people were using it. For instance there was a time when Facebook was university only and invite only.

And this is all for people that are of the 'legal age' so to speak using it. For kids, who are going to be even more insecure, have more ongoing brain development, and such - I think the idea of creating a non-addictive or non-harmful social media is basically a nonstarter. The same is true of use by adults as well, but we generally are more accepting of adults' right to engage in self destructive behaviors.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#37

Post by nkrisc »

testing22321 wrote: post #24
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #12

Forcing social media apps to have a less addictive design is a much better way to protect young people's brains than a social media age limit is (and frankly adults need help here too).

Forcing alcoholic drinks to have a less addictive product is a much better way to protect young people’s brains than an alcohol age limit is (and frankly adults need help there too).

Yes, that would help. Putting regulatory caps on the strength of alcoholic drinks would probably go a long way towards reducing harm across all of society.

Of course there will be bootleggers, but the benefits would probably outweigh any of the incidental drawbacks.

And I say this as someone who drinks. I would be fine with regulation like this and making a sacrifice of something small I enjoy if it meant greater good across society.

Re: EU Commission: addictive design Instagram and Facebook in breach of the DSA

#40

Post by philipallstar »

amelius wrote: post #21
littlecranky67 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Online advertisements should be forbidden as a whole. The attention-stealing and engagement-maximising internet with all it horribly effects only exist, due to advertising. And we know that the world without online ads is perfectly possible and livable, since we all lived through 1996.

Yeah, but why don't we ever hear any MEPs talk about it like that?

MEPs want to write rules that mean they get to fine rich US companies. Local advertising might be worse for you overall but you'd have to do more work to get less free money.
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