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Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

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Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#341

Post by ano-ther »

Ntrails wrote: post #319
pshirshov wrote: post #293

I worked at a company which was doing medical billing for ambulances among other things. Essentially, the bills are always inflated so when the settlement comes the providers get 20..50%. The crucial procedure is so called "medical coding" where medical notes (sometimes - scrawled on paper with a pencil) are being turned into bills - and that's where additional codes are getting added and more expensive codes are sel…

> an average helicopter bill was smth around $200K if I remember correctly, with spikes up to $500K. Those numbers made me blanch somewhat! Having been in a helicopter (aka Air Ambulance) in the UK, all of which operate as charities iirc, I was curious about their costs. > The average cost of a helicopter mission is £4,748* and the average cost of a critical care car or rapid response vehicle mission is £2,054*[1]. h…

Those are more sane numbers (unless you go by helicopter across the US).

Also found this intriguing in your source:

> London’s Air Ambulance crew made history in 1993 by performing the world’s first successful pre-hospital open-heart surgery at the roadside.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#342

Post by pjc50 »

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #309
wisty wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the US also pays a TON of tax dollars to a broken, overregulated system. IIRC if you look at the cost of Medicaide, Medicare, VA, and other federal and state spending it's the same as most other countries per capita or as a percent of GDP. The US taxpayer pays about as much as Canadians to fund their public system, then pays the same amount again for private cover since it's not universal. No I'm not making a typ…

>But no one wants to fix it. US doctors are overpaid. US nurses are over paid. Dug companies. Admin. Lawyers. Everyone who makes the system work, and everyone who makes the system a mess are paid a fortune for it. 17% of GDP is healthcare. So between 1:10 and 2:10 people in this country are making more than they otherwise would (note I did not say wealthier) because the system is screwed up and hoovers up more of eve…

Possibly reasonable point about labour supply ruined by an absurd analogy with slavery.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#343

Post by pjc50 »

anonym29 wrote: post #333
ciclotrone wrote: post #326

Last year I had appendicitis in Italy, where I live. I called a cab to reach the nearest hospital, since I didn't feel so bad as warranting an ambulance. I got accepted, visited, transferred to the larger nearby hospital by ambulance, appendectomy, 4 nights stay, and I was provided with the drugs for the convalescence. When I was dismissed I took another cab back. Total expense: ~25€ for the two taxi rides. Very happ…

This sounds like a great deal if your annual taxes are less than your annual unsubsidized medical expenses, and a terrible deal if your annual taxes stretch into the six figure range as a young healthy person.

> annual taxes stretch into the six figure range as a young healthy person

At that point you're in the, what, top 2% of salaries? Especially for your age band.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#344

Post by anonym29 »

Avicebron wrote: post #338
anonym29 wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds like a great deal if your annual taxes are less than your annual unsubsidized medical expenses, and a terrible deal if your annual taxes stretch into the six figure range as a young healthy person.

Doesn't this young person theoretically become older and less healthy as time passes? How many young people have six figures in taxes and not understand reciprocity?

Reciprocity is great when all parties contribute equal amounts, all parties receive an equal share of the benefit, and the arrangement is strictly voluntary. Think toll roads where everyone pays the same price, only the people using the road pay for it, and everyone using it benefits from it.

It's less great when some parties are expected to give more than they receive in return (in order to provide for those who give less than they receive in return), without their consent, enforced by the state's monopoly on lawful violence, and are demonized for so little as daring to express dissatisfaction with the involuntary arrangement.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#345

Post by OKRainbowKid »

newaccount670 wrote: post #340
onion2k wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the question is "Should ambulances be a thing?" though. It's a question of "Should someone in a situation where they need an ambulance have to balance the potentially life-threatening impact of saying no versus the potentially financially ruinous impact of saying yes?" The (fairly obvious) answer to that no one should be in that situation. It's horrible. Society should find a better way to pay for ambul…

[flagged]

So in your eyes, the population of several western countries is (and has been for decades) dominated by complete morons, resulting in free or almost free ambulance rides?

And what does the Democratic party have to do with all that? Your whole comment just seems like a thinly veiled and insulting political rant. Going by your account name, this seems to be a pattern.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#346

Post by pebble »

newaccount670 wrote: post #340
onion2k wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the question is "Should ambulances be a thing?" though. It's a question of "Should someone in a situation where they need an ambulance have to balance the potentially life-threatening impact of saying no versus the potentially financially ruinous impact of saying yes?" The (fairly obvious) answer to that no one should be in that situation. It's horrible. Society should find a better way to pay for ambul…

[flagged]

So people should be getting financially ruined to god-forbid prevent some abuse of the system? As long as there is no abuse everything else is hunky-dory?

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#347

Post by gessha »

philipallstar wrote: post #331
otherme123 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society should find a better way to pay for ambulances Society has this figured out, at least a decent solution that works until we find a perfect one. Only the US society seems to be unable to find a solution.

[flagged]

Surrounded by the barbarian warmonger nations of Canada and Mexico, the US has to increase its military budget to close to a trillion to pay for wars it definitely hasn’t been single-handedly starting since the 1970s while the USAID budget which is 5% of the military’s which tries to eradicate tuberculosis and malaria needs to go. Makes total sense.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#348

Post by hilariously »

philipallstar wrote: post #331
otherme123 wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Society should find a better way to pay for ambulances Society has this figured out, at least a decent solution that works until we find a perfect one. Only the US society seems to be unable to find a solution.

[flagged]

In FY 2024, 0.3% of federal spending was by the US Agency for International Development ($21.7B)

https://usafacts.org/explainers/what-does-the-us-government-...

The war in Iran in MAY was reported at 29 billion dollars. It's probably been a bit more since then. Justifying stupid actions because you hate brown people isn't good for any of us.

Re: Why American ambulance rides are so expensive

#350

Post by [deleted] »

pjc50 wrote: post #343
anonym29 wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This sounds like a great deal if your annual taxes are less than your annual unsubsidized medical expenses, and a terrible deal if your annual taxes stretch into the six figure range as a young healthy person.

> annual taxes stretch into the six figure range as a young healthy person At that point you're in the, what, top 2% of salaries? Especially for your age band.

[deleted]
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