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EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

patrick-breyer.de

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Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#131

Post by inferniac »

teekert wrote: post #38

This is a nice piece of democracy right here: "a measure it had rejected twice in March. Although a majority of voting Members of the European Parliament (MEPs) actually opposed the regulation (314 against, 276 in favor, 17 abstentions), the motion to reject it failed to secure the required absolute majority of 361 votes. As a result, mass scanning is now permitted again until 2028." "Oh no we can't get a majority to…

>This is a nice piece of democracy right here:

this is just eu in a nutshell, the irish were made to vote on both nice and lisbon treaties twice (both were voted no in the first vote)

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#132

Post by mizaru »

weberer wrote: post #94
vrganj wrote: post #23

Brought to you - as always - by the Conservatives. Conservatism is just fascism with a slightly nicer image.

This was overwhelmingly approved by "The Left in the European Parliament" (that's their actual coalition name) as well as the Greens. It was overwhelmingly rejected by the European People's Party (AKA "The Right"). And mixed among other groups (S&D and Conservatives). https://howtheyvote.eu/votes/195775

No, it's the other way around. Quoting another comment:

>"Yes" means stop control, because it's a "proposition de rejet" we're looking at. rejet = reject

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#133

Post by wolvoleo »

onemoresoop wrote: post #115
sunshine-o wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What should worry everybody is the big picture (trying to abstract from politics, ideologies and specific situation). In recent years we had: - Europe is now at war with Russia (neighbor) - Its relationship with the US is rapidly deteriorating (main partner, de facto protector) - Its relationship with China is also rapidly deteriorating - It is getting very antagonistic with it own citizen and some individual member…

EU is doing some concerning moves but, looking at your points, Russia attacked Ukraine. EU is not at war with Russia, only supporting Ukraine. Second, the relationship with US is deteriorating due to Trump. As a matter of fact all US relationships are deteriorating for the same reason. Where have you been the past years? Im not going to bother to respond to the following points because you mix some reality with propa…

Yeah US is threatening to invade and take over Canada, Greenland, I mean no wonder the alliance is no longer strong right?

And the internal struggles are indeed a problem, this is due to the extreme right which has completely taken over America (and is sponsored by Russia). It was good to see the Hungarians came to their senses but it's worrying that the EU doesn't have a mechanism to expel countries.

The problem is who do we ally with that we can trust now. Russia and America obviously not. Canada yes but they're not big. China just serves its own interests, they will never care about a partnership. They just want our money to buy their products, nothing else.

I think South America is another potential one and the EU is trying to connect there with eg Mercosur. But America is sponsoring the extreme right there too as you can see in Honduras and Colombia recently. And in Venezuela of course.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#134

Post by jltsiren »

logifail wrote: post #74
budududuroiu wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, then just let the normal legislative process run its course, no need to bleed political capital and get an already polarised electorate to hate the EU even more by shoving this legislation through in this way.

> no need to bleed political capital I'm not sure the EU needs to worry about political capital in the way that many national and regional governments do. Power moves through negotiations between institutions, party groups, lobbyists, activists, and heads of government rather than through anything voters can trace. If one is being unkind, it's basically backroom deals all the way down. Naturally, the EU has more resp…

That's how multi-party parliamentarism usually works. A minority is not allowed to choose the leader just because they are a slightly larger minority than the others.

Because no party has an outright majority, there are weeks of negotiations after the elections, as the parties try to find a compromise acceptable to a majority. Once a deal has been reached, the parliament votes to confirm it. If the vote fails, the parties return to negotiations.

Von der Leyen was chosen to head the Commission, because she was an acceptable compromise. All lead candidates had been tried before her, but all of them failed to obtain majority support in the negotiations.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#135

Post by attila-lendvai »

superloika wrote: post #28
budududuroiu wrote: post #6

Roberta Metsola's actions this week jeopardise the legitimacy of the EU project as a whole. It's clear that member countries use the EU as a blame-laundering mechanism to pass domestically unpopular laws, but the forcing of this vote under the urgency procedure that requires absolute majority to reject, on the last EP session before summer break is so blatant that it might awaken people that might've overlooked the s…

> it might awaken people that might've overlooked the structural failures of the EU and finally radicalise them Haha, no. As long as there is bread and circus, nothing wil happen.

well, bread is running our at beakneck speed...

that's the reason they are busy igniting a war by the time the defaulting begins, so that there's some external boogieman to blame instead of them...

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#136

Post by theodric »

bluebarbet wrote: post #76
superloika wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it might awaken people that might've overlooked the structural failures of the EU and finally radicalise them Haha, no. As long as there is bread and circus, nothing wil happen.

This comment does not add any value to the discussion. PS: Sorry, but "haha nothing matters" cynicism does NOT add anything to the discussion. In fact it straightforwardly breaks a whole bunch of HN guidelines: "Be curious", "Don't be generically negative", "Don't be snarky", "Don't post shallow dismissals", etc. This forum is supposed to be better than the R-site.

Many of us find it difficult to be relentlessly positive as we watch organizations that constantly paint themselves as the epitome of democracy act in a way counter to the repeatedly-expressed will of the people. I cannot smile my way into fascism.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#137

Post by dachworker »

netsharc wrote: post #5
miroljub wrote: post #2

And so, step by step, in the name of child protection and similar excuses, we lose liberties and rights one by one. Welcome to the Brave New 1984 We World. Big Brother loves us. We are living through the time best described by Zamyatin, Orwell, and Huxley.

Man, the EU is supposed to be the beacon of liberal democracy (after the light of Reagan's shining city on the hill is now truly extinguishing), but with shit like this, it's really making enemies left and right (metaphorically and spectrally).

Here's a thought: maybe liberal democracy was never very free.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#138

Post by CrisMystik »

One thing that should be noted is that, since the Parliament has been able to approve an amendment by absolute majority (which explicitly excludes E2E chats), the procedure is not over and the law is still not enacted, a third reading is still needed, after negotiations with the Council and the Commission, and in this case the Parliament will be able to reject the act by a simple majority

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#139

Post by elAhmo »

This might get this control out, but people's anti-EU stance will just be increased by this and long-term this is a terrible move.

Just fueling material for right wingers who will take advantage of this and push for secessionist stuff.

EU is in dire need to have VERY POPULAR measures among people, not idiotic stuff like this which is a step in a wrong direction.

Re: EU Parliament greenlights Chat Control 1.0

#140

Post by tartoran »

wolvoleo wrote: post #133
onemoresoop wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU is doing some concerning moves but, looking at your points, Russia attacked Ukraine. EU is not at war with Russia, only supporting Ukraine. Second, the relationship with US is deteriorating due to Trump. As a matter of fact all US relationships are deteriorating for the same reason. Where have you been the past years? Im not going to bother to respond to the following points because you mix some reality with propa…

Yeah US is threatening to invade and take over Canada, Greenland, I mean no wonder the alliance is no longer strong right? And the internal struggles are indeed a problem, this is due to the extreme right which has completely taken over America (and is sponsored by Russia). It was good to see the Hungarians came to their senses but it's worrying that the EU doesn't have a mechanism to expel countries. The problem is…

Right wing populism is growing in EU as well. That is also sponsored by Russia but also by Trump/Vance etc..
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