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Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

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Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#61

Post by chenglong-hn »

YuechenLi wrote: post #54
chenglong-hn wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do find the chartType part is not quite elegant, since templates should be more extensible. We will need to fix that. For other parts, it's quite common in visualization and diagram etc libraries to have json, since they are easily portable in different rendering contexts.

I'm sure you know that JSON are object literals in TypeScript, there isn't really even a serialization process that's needed there. The AST/IR can still be in JSON, but the authoring surface can be a restricted subset that does not allow logic to execute, that way you can still get the type safety and functionality of TS when you need conditional/loops/logic without throwing away what TS already gives you. I mean, it…

JSON schema can do it to some degree, I think?

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#63

Post by dominotw »

pwarner wrote: post #28
cpard wrote: post #26

There’s an emerging pattern in agentic systems and this project is a great example. A deterministic layer like a compiler or generator of code with some kind of IR that the LLM generates and feeds it with. I feel we will be seeing this more and more in the near future.

When I first saw Claude generating PPT decks by writing Python code instead of making the XML directly, it was sort of an "aha moment" for me. This seems to be the path for many things. It also feels slightly limiting, and like a hack LONG term, but 100% correct approach for a while.

can you save that python and regenrate that exact powerpoint later ? maybe check it into repo isntead of powerpoint to genrate variations.

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#64

Post by chenglong-hn »

ajrouvoet wrote: post #32
cpard wrote: post #26

There’s an emerging pattern in agentic systems and this project is a great example. A deterministic layer like a compiler or generator of code with some kind of IR that the LLM generates and feeds it with. I feel we will be seeing this more and more in the near future.

A well designed intermediary enables both validation and control over the output independent of the AI. This changes the interaction model between human and AI from delegation to collaboration.

also user interaction afterwards -- if can be frustrating if the only way the user can interact with the chart is to chat with the agent again (simple spec allows easy UI interaction!)

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#65

Post by horsh1 »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #52
wuliwong wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this literally made for AI agents to be accessed through an MCP server? Seems to me the AI agents part of the marketing is important.

But why be exclusive? Why not "Chart language for computer programs to generate"? I don't want to use an agent at all, but i wouldn't mind generating some charts with an easy-to-generate markup language...

Because these are completely different requirements.

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#67

Post by avadodin »

fernie wrote: post #55
bigfishrunning wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why be exclusive? Why not "Chart language for computer programs to generate"? I don't want to use an agent at all, but i wouldn't mind generating some charts with an easy-to-generate markup language...

But for that we already have mermaid.js (and its precursor Graphviz/dot). The only reason to use this instead of existing, mature ones designed for humans is if you are an AI agent.

Mermaid looks terrible.

It is only better than nothing for the purpose of showing it to people whether produced by an LLM, by a human, or by both.

Your employees may just accept the internal slop, but at some point, you have to show your charts to your customer.

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#68

Post by 4petesake »

bigfishrunning wrote: post #52
wuliwong wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't this literally made for AI agents to be accessed through an MCP server? Seems to me the AI agents part of the marketing is important.

But why be exclusive? Why not "Chart language for computer programs to generate"? I don't want to use an agent at all, but i wouldn't mind generating some charts with an easy-to-generate markup language...

Careful, they'll spring something XML-derived on us.

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#69

Post by bodash »

YuechenLi wrote: post #41

>Instead of requiring verbose low-level parameters such as scales, axes, spacing, and layout. Ok, Microsoft is conflating two different things here: LLMs don't really care about code being low level and verbose, they can read things like Assembly and SPIR-V just fine: visualization is the real issue in that LLMs have no natural understanding of spatial composition through visual comparison because they literally "see…

Agreed, JSON is not the most optimal spec language choice, but is it better if different projects all started to writing their own specs?

Related: https://www.openui.com/blog/stop-making-ai-write-json

Re: Show HN: Microsoft releases Flint, a visualization language for AI agents

#70

Post by dang »

FailMore wrote: post #6

The charts are very nice, and I think the visualisation layer for LLMs is a very interesting problem. I’ve been building https://smalldocs.org for this exact reason. It’s an office suite for AI agents - but my main use case is giving a cli based LLM the canvas to express itself - charts, mermaid diagrams, etc. I’ve extended it a bit further to be a format for all types of work so the agent can embed slides and spread…

Can you please stop? You're crossing the line into spamming HN and we're getting complaints.

It sounds like cool work, but you shouldn't be using HN in this way. Linking to your project occasionally in a relevant context is fine, but this should be a (small) minority of what you post to HN.

From https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html: "Please don't use HN primarily for promotion. It's ok to post your own stuff part of the time, but the primary use of the site should be for curiosity."

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