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China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

bbc.com

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Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#361

Post by nixon_why69 »

insane_dreamer wrote: post #359
nixon_why69 wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Xi in particular seems to be personally offended by small scale corruption like business lunches. Huge crackdown on it for probably a negative political benefit.

there have always been ongoing crackdown on small scale corruption ("flies"); it's taking down the big "tigers", who all just happened to be from other CCP factions, that made Xi stand out among his predecessors.

It's gotten ridiculous in the last 2 years according to my hearsay, like it's actually hurting the restaurant industry.

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#363

Post by throw10920 »

isr wrote: post #327
throw10920 wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ah, the old “only western people have morals, everyone else just cares about how it looks” argument. That's not even remotely close to what I said. You should read the comment you're responding before responding with ignorant and blatantly manipulative falsehoods. > And where did you get this super objective assessment that eastern peoples only care about “saving face”? Again - never said anything like that. Learn…

I'm not the guy who responded to you, but “only western people have morals, everyone else just cares about how it looks” is pretty much what you tried to imply. And before you start on me, yes - I'm able to "think", and no, I'm not a "troll" If its not what you wanted to imply, then perhaps you'd be better served at owning up & clarifying, rather than insulting others who merely pointed out what you originally wrote.…

> pretty much what you tried to imply

Ahhh, the propagandist's classic tactic - when unable to muster even the feeblest possible response to an argument, just make up things and pretend that the other party said them.

Fact: I said nothing of the sort. You are lying.

> owning up

I have nothing to own up to because I said nothing of the sort, and anyone with basic reading skills can see that.

> clarifying

I was exactly as clear as I needed to be. I do not need to provide every single possible hedge on my statements. It is ok to not be perfectly clear and disclaim every negative, and this is now normal, sane, socially well-adjusted people behave.

It is completely unacceptable (and more than a little psychotic) to take that ambiguity and interpret it in the worst possible way.

It is downright evil to then defend that malicious misinterpretation instead of apologizing.

You are evil.

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#365

Post by saimiam »

throw10920 wrote: post #287
SepiaSapient wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Spoilers for The Wire) I buy the whole thing that some cultures give more weight to face-saving than others. I would classify my supposedly western country (Chile) as one that gives it more weight than, for example, Germany. Even then, this just sounds like a kneejerk "you cannot trust these dastardly orientals". Face saving is a thing in the US, to the point that it's a common plot point prestige TV (e.g most of Th…

Nowhere did I say that Western countries don't care about saving face - it's just not a deeply embedded cultural priority that is nearly as valued as it is in many Eastern cultures (including, relevantly, China).

How is the existence of a PR/spin industry, the fact that many Americans live way beyond their means, or the proliferation of influencers whose job is to show a specific story not evidence of a society that values appearances and will do a lot to protect face?

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#366

Post by D_Alex »

trhway wrote: post #194
pessimizer wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are just weird fantasies that you're writing out, with absolutely no reference to any events that have happened in China. You seem to just be writing fiction, and assigning it to the Chinese. The Chinese are actually people, though, they're real. If you want to accuse them of unremitting evil, you should be able to talk about something they did in detail. That does not mean that you should google "China bad" an…

>What Cold War propaganda did to Western brains is tragic. Some weird fantasies you have. I grew up in USSR. So very well familiar with inner workings of such regimes.

Did you feel safe, growing up?

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#367

Post by bigglywiggler »

So many comments here by western people clinging to the only thing that they have left. The idea that somewhere in the world there is 'injustice' and a 'lack of freedom' and 'dictatorship' makes their absolute dystopian hellscape seem somewhat barely tolerable in their addled minds because they can at least imagine that elsewhere there is some big bad dictator and therefore they are comparatively free. No matter that they are poor and getting poorer or that their governments and companies are all sold out to billionaires and wrecked by private equity. No matter that their freedom begins and ends at consumerism and the vague idea that the police won't arrest them for posting something online. Apparently freedom to have a strong government that actually funds things for the public and doesn't suck billionaire cocks is not as important as having the opportunity to get into debt and spaff shite on the internet. If these people actually went to China and saw it with their own eyes then they would realise that they have been lied to. It's extremely sad to see.

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#368

Post by throw10920 »

saimiam wrote: post #365
throw10920 wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowhere did I say that Western countries don't care about saving face - it's just not a deeply embedded cultural priority that is nearly as valued as it is in many Eastern cultures (including, relevantly, China).

How is the existence of a PR/spin industry, the fact that many Americans live way beyond their means, or the proliferation of influencers whose job is to show a specific story not evidence of a society that values appearances and will do a lot to protect face?

> a society that values appearances and will do a lot to protect face

Read my comment again, carefully, and you'll understand that your response is unrelated to my point.

Also: all of these things exist in large, industrialized Eastern nations too. You've clearly never lived in any of those places or even had tangential exposure to their culture. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that - just understand that you are exactly the kind of person who is going to have the hardest time understanding the cultural difference - which is part of my point.

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#369

Post by Supermancho »

threatofrain wrote: post #307
warumdarum wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

? Everyone in the party is incolved in similar crimes. The only thing they are guilty off in addition is a lack of loyalty to emperor xi. Incompetence and criminal corruption, that you can edit out of history, but intrigue is unforgivable.

You're assuming that this guy was actually being prosecuted for crimes or that this guy lacked loyalty to Xi Jinping. A tremendous number of top generals and leadership has been wiped out in a short time and not necessarily refilled, and it's not because China has a huge disloyalty problem.

> You're assuming that this guy was actually being prosecuted for crimes or that this guy lacked loyalty to Xi Jinping

That's not an "or" question, imo. If you threaten the king by having too much power, too many allies, or too keen a mind, you get moved off the board. Disloyalty and risk of disloyalty are both abhorrent to autocrats.

Re: China sentences official to death for taking $325M in bribes

#370

Post by throw10920 »

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #259
throw10920 wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's one of the big cultural differences that people from the West don't really get - that "saving face" is one of the core concepts that Eastern societies are built on - not the actual things that, when discovered, cause you to lose face (e.g. corruption).

Wasnt the especially hard trial and punishment of Chelsea manning, assange, etc. not a punishment by the western establishment for losing face?

...no? Not that the answer to that question is even relevant to the comment I actually wrote.
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