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Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

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Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#371

Post by newyankee »

ikut3hva wrote: post #165

Hi everyone I don’t usually comment on topics like this because there are so many biases and different perspectives involved. In the end, I believe only the person who has actually gone through the experience can truly understand it; otherwise, it often becomes just another judgment. We are an ASEAN family earning more than €200k gross annually (sorry for mentioning the TC, but there is a reason for it—please keep re…

Well I am an Indian who lived in US and worked for top companies for 10 years and left back to my home country as I did not want to be beholden to the Green card waiting time or take some unethical pathways (I see a lot of abuse of O1 now). I find coworkers from smaller and friendlier countries sail through and become Americans.

The point is that immigration can never really become a true meritocracy and even I recognised the privileges I had to reach to US in the first place. The country's ethos, ideas are grandfathered into the law alongwith numerous loopholes or sneaky ways. There is never a social compact where I did X , I deserve Y coming true. I suspect globally we are at the tail end of this type of immigration from Global South to Global North as well

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#372

Post by FabCH »

hparadiz wrote: post #359
FabCH wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your aunt is sort of correct, but not really. If you move to CH on your German EU passport, register at the local authorities and get your residency card, most traditional Swiss banks will open an account for you. You just won’t be able to do it online or with the Neo-banks. But an actual physical UBS office or Kantonbank will eventually be able to handle the paperwork for you.

I thought it was a regular thing for Americans or anyone in the world to be able to make a Swiss account? Is that not the case? Or is it different if you live there?

If you are not a resident, don’t bother trying unless you plan to have 30M or more in the account.

If you are a resident, you can easily open a normal account in minutes… unless you are US, Russian or Belarus citizen.

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#373

Post by joe_mamba »

romanhounds wrote: post #349
jitix wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then why are you complaining about the language requirement for permanent residency? You knew the tradeoffs and chose them willingly, enjoy your income, invest in your home country and move back once you retire. Simply making higher-than-median income should not make you eligible for permanent residency. Cultural immersion and assimilation is important to maintain social stability and language is just the first step.…

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Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#374

Post by BeetleB »

aleph_minus_one wrote: post #337
BeetleB wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can only speculate, but usually when such phrases come up, it's about things like not being part of the in-group - people they know throwing parties and not inviting them, etc.

> I can only speculate, but usually when such phrases come up, it's about things like not being part of the in-group - people they know throwing parties and not inviting them, etc. Concerning "part of the in-group": It is very usual that in Germany, you don't become a "friend" fast (the German translation of "friend", [der] Freund, has a much deeper meaning than the US-American understanding of the English word). Fri…

Knowing Germans, I'm not disagreeing with you - merely pointing out the perception.

(I have heard bad stories from Germany, but that was decades ago).

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#375

Post by overfeed »

rurp wrote: post #263
dgs_sgd wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate your perspective, but I was curious what B1 proficiency actually entails and this is what I found [1]: - understand the main points of clear standard speech on familiar topics such as work, school, or leisure - manage most situations that occur while traveling in German-speaking areas - produce simple, connected text on familiar subjects - describe experiences, events, dreams, hopes, and ambitions, and b…

It seems weird to me that someone would even want to settle in a foreign country without a good understanding of the language and cultural basics. I've done some traveling in non-English speaking countries and it was a huge hurdle not being completely fluent in the local language. It just seems like common sense to me to dive in all the way if you are moving somewhere long term. I don't really see what a good salary…

> It seems weird to me that someone would even want to settle in a foreign country without a good understanding of the language and cultural basics

These people typically call themselves "expatriates"

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#376

Post by izacus »

Tade0 wrote: post #58

As an outsider, but hailing from Germany's eastern neighbor and one of the largest sources of immigrants: Overall sentiment is that the juice ain't worth the squeeze any more. Back when my country became a full member of Schengen(2008) the ratio of GDP per capita between Germany and us was around 3.3x - salaries were roughly proportionally higher, so just about any job was worth moving there and potentially going thr…

Will this overall sentiment actually be confirmed with migration numbers if we check them?

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#377

Post by hparadiz »

FabCH wrote: post #372
hparadiz wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought it was a regular thing for Americans or anyone in the world to be able to make a Swiss account? Is that not the case? Or is it different if you live there?

If you are not a resident, don’t bother trying unless you plan to have 30M or more in the account. If you are a resident, you can easily open a normal account in minutes… unless you are US, Russian or Belarus citizen.

I was more thinking a brokerage account for typical stock / index fund investing.

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#378

Post by bellowsgulch »

BeetleB wrote: post #319
bellowsgulch wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole immigrants who don't integrate seems to be a constant issue in every developed country across the globe, with the exception of maybe Japan, who is xenophobic enough that you wouldn't want to try to become Japanese anyway. Canada, England, France, and the US, to name a few, seem to have done it wrong considering how immigration is a constant complaint and weaponized topic in their politics, but likewise Japa…

> The whole immigrants who don't integrate seems to be a constant issue in every developed country across the globe I can't speak for the other countries, but in the US it's almost entirely an agenda being pushed. When I hear people say this, it's not because of any experience they've had, but just a repetition of talking points. Virtually none of them had a negative story to tell. I've heard far, far worse stories i…

There are notable issues in the Southwest in the United States where people don't speak any English at all, and speak only Spanish, suggesting they are legal citizens born of illegal immigrants, or are still illegal immigrants themselves.

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#379

Post by FabCH »

zerr wrote: post #367
FabCH wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, why is „learn the language“ not a rational and pragmatic requirement? Seems rational to me. Want to live in country X permanently? Learn language X.

I mean, when you have already proven that you are net positive for the state, and continue doing so, requiring you to pass some exams is not rational. PR != citizenship. Will I have a bit difficulty buying some groceries in a local market? Maybe, but that shouldn't bother the state. Also, you can live permanently without PR. PR unlocks some additional perks, which again, have nothing to do with linguistics.

Are you a net positive?

Just because somebody pays taxes, it doesn’t necessarily make them a net positive.

For example, do you contribute culturally? That can be quite hard to do without speaking the language.

What about defense. Would you fight for the country? Hard to do if you don’t understand the orders.

What about spiritually? Emotionally?

Re: Why skilled workers come to Germany and then leave again

#380

Post by nubg »

FinnLobsien wrote: post #178

I‘m German, but I no longer live in Germany, so I can’t relate to the experience of immigrating to Germany. I think a big part of the issue is a certain German presumptuousness. There’s a general sense that Germany is a prosperous, influential country. The reason for that must be that things are done correctly in Germany. I think this is an inherited attitude that doesn’t really correspond to reality anymore as syste…

where do you live now?
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