Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch) • Hacker News Board

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#231

Post by mrguyorama » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:23 PM UTC

panzagl wrote: post #185

jasonlotito wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In the US we sometimes use the term “bribe” in morally neutral or even positive situations. I live here in the US. I've NEVER heard the term bribe in a neutral or even positive way. It might be used in a mocking way, as if to mock the idea of bribes, but never seriously. So, unless you are confusing that mocking nature as morally neutral or even positive, this is incorrect.

You've never heard a parent or teacher say they bribed their kids for good behavior?

Never in a morally neutral or positive way!

You "Bribe" your kid with extra time on the iPad. You don't "Bribe" them with wholesome things.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#232

Post by mrguyorama » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:25 PM UTC

blueaquilae wrote: post #11

Experts in flies reproduction leave fro Netherlands.

You mean the thing that held Screwworm at bay for decades and kept our beef prices low? That we will now need to spend $Billions re-curtailing because we don't have as much of the capability to do that anymore?

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#233

Post by WarmWash » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:26 PM UTC

0xDEAFBEAD wrote: post #214

WarmWash wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Actually, I'm baffled at how US performs poorly for their people given they have abundant energy. You feel that way because the media (and the internet) is hyper focused on the bottom 50% of Americans. The households with 2 people earning If you look at the higher brackets (you have to look because "Americans in the 75th percentile live great" is not a clickable story) America is a better place to live if you work a…

>You feel that way because the media (and the internet) is hyper focused on the bottom 50% of Americans. The households with 2 people earning Poverty in the US is similar to poverty in Sweden, according to this dataset: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/poverty-share-on-less-tha... But the median American earns far higher wages than the median Swede: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/daily-median-income I think the…

I mean the real unspeakeable secret is how the American mid-high-middle-class/upper-class has so effectively turned financially transparent despite being the wealthiest group in the country. The 65% to 99% are just an absolute hulking bag of cash.

The battle in the US is between the mid-low-middle-class/lower-class and the 1%. Which is just so incredibly effective at diverting attention from where all the actual money is. When you can pull your head out of the swamp of social media and fountains of clickbait/class ragebait, there is this huge elephant sitting in the room with it's finger over it's mouth doing the "shhh, be quiet" motion.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#234

Post by vrganj » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:28 PM UTC

0xDEAFBEAD wrote: post #225

vrganj wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everybody is welcome to contribute to the free world, be they American or not.

Interestingly some Europeans also feel that Europe is becoming less free and are fleeing to the US: https://www.foxnews.com/world/anti-greta-activist-flees-euro...

Ah, Miss Seibt, haven't heard from her in a while. She's a notorious QAnon follower, antisemite and just generally odious far-right extremist.

I'm not surprised she's looking to be with like-minded people. A bit like Lord Haw-Haw back in the day, I suppose.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#235

Post by mrguyorama » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:28 PM UTC

pjc50 wrote: post #19

mono442 wrote: post #4

Isn't much of the science work just taking money for doing basically nothing? I don't think that is a loss for the us.

Hacker News really isn't what it used to be, huh.

These people have always been here.

They were the ones complaining that we were "brainwashed" when we decried Trump in 2016. They were the ones complaining we were overreacting to him being elected again. They were the ones cheering for DOGE while we pointed out how obviously stupid it was.

Now they feel safe to be loud and proud of their ignorance.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#236

Post by voxl » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:30 PM UTC

amoshebb wrote: post #157

I could only find 4 names: 1 full prof at Vanderbilt with a real research program who has been listed as PI on a bunch of grants. "Top researcher" may be generous, but based on nothing I'd say reasonable description. The other 3: 1 is a VU Amsterdam PhD who was on a Netherlands Government funded 24-month postdoc in Harvard who's been at VU Amsterdam since 2017. 1 is an adjunct (on leave) prof from Israel who has work…

Researchers _would_ leave in droves if they could. But it turns out the entire world doesn't actually care much for research. The US was actually unique in that regard.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#237

Post by Zigurd » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:41 PM UTC

WarmWash wrote: post #123

Zigurd wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Though it was years ago now, I did spend a couple of years frequently traveling to China for fairly long stays. I learned enough Mandarin to get by on my own. The "scariest" thing is realizing you might have to walk for an hour in a random direction to come across a landmark like a known metro station or a hotel where you can get a taxi and have the concierge translate your desired destination. I was mostly in first…

I think the concern is more along the lines of social integration than criminal hostility. Japan for instance has basically zero crime, and tons of tourists, but is notoriously impossible to ever become "Japanese" as an outsider.

I have to wonder who aspires to become Japanese or Chinese, or even the superficially plausible goal of me becoming German. It just wouldn't enter my mind.

As for social integration, the Chinese people I met seemed astonished and pleased that I could make any headway with the language or the food.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#238

Post by spockz » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:42 PM UTC

daedrdev wrote: post #203

mnky9800n wrote: post #146

I apologise if this is overly negative. It is based on my experience working as a soft money researcher (my own grants) at a Dutch university. My opinions may not be shared. In my experience The Netherlands is a rather unsupportive place to do research. There is essentially no money from the government that will pay salaries in full, especially early career salaries (vini, vidi, vici). I have had friends win ERC gran…

> that were fired as a result because there was not a space in the department to hire them full time (Dutch work law requires contracts to become permanent after a certain number of years of working). This is a very common law in european companies and is killing economic growth. Idk why they do this.

The idea is to prevent employees from being used as full time employees but squeezed and then let go.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#239

Post by Freak_NL » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:44 PM UTC

amoshebb wrote: post #157

I could only find 4 names: 1 full prof at Vanderbilt with a real research program who has been listed as PI on a bunch of grants. "Top researcher" may be generous, but based on nothing I'd say reasonable description. The other 3: 1 is a VU Amsterdam PhD who was on a Netherlands Government funded 24-month postdoc in Harvard who's been at VU Amsterdam since 2017. 1 is an adjunct (on leave) prof from Israel who has work…

> I could only find 4 names:

They haven't published the full list of the 34 researchers accepted so far:

> Namen van de 34 bursalen maakt NWO niet bekend, aldus een woordvoerder, omdat de aanstellingsprocedures nog lopen en sommige onderzoekers geen publiciteit willen.

(NRC July 7th, https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2026/07/07/tulp-fonds-voor-academi...)

So you'll only find the names of those who are now in a position to speak out about this issue.

Re: Top researchers leave USA for the Netherlands (in Dutch)

#240

Post by tokai » Tue, Jul 07, 2026, 5:47 PM UTC

zyxzevn wrote: post #163

mnky9800n wrote: post #146

I apologise if this is overly negative. It is based on my experience working as a soft money researcher (my own grants) at a Dutch university. My opinions may not be shared. In my experience The Netherlands is a rather unsupportive place to do research. There is essentially no money from the government that will pay salaries in full, especially early career salaries (vini, vidi, vici). I have had friends win ERC gran…

I see a lot of complaining from small companies and startups. The taxing system is slowly becoming communism (I have no better word). And they also are stopping farming, based on bad ideas. I tried to get into fundamental research, but disliked the burocratic approach in Dutch universities.

You don't really pay tax in a communist system. No need if the state pays all salaries. China first got a tax law in 1980 as part of Xiaoping's modernization of the Chinese economy and the opening up for the private market.