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The revenge of the philosophy majors

nytimes.com

51–60 of 292 posts

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#51
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If pay, hours, benefits, and type of work mean nothing to you, then maybe this is an apt point.

If service to others and to society mean anything to you, working in Starbucks or any fast food job will teach you more about humanity and human society than most college grads learn from a humanities degree.

But will it help those baristas pay off the student loans that paid for their philosophy degrees?

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#52

When I was in college, a philosophy degree was seen as excellent training for a career in Law.

But a law degree is probably even better. I know what you mean though, consulting companies also hire the (top 1-3%) philosophy majors and math/physics majors for the same reason. Good thought processes.

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both professions require writing detailed, overly specific, reasonably watertight arguments that will be read by only a handful of people, so that tracks

Using a vocabulary that is known only to themselves.

> Using a vocabulary that is known only to themselves.

So? Almost all professions have jargon known only to themselves. You think most people have any clue what a garbage collector is?

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#54
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the AI is digesting all the philosophy material ever published then why do they need philosophers?

knowing all the philosophy every published is not being a philosopher there was literature about 15 years or so ago stating Philosophy as being an uncommonly lucrative course of study, in part citing Reid Hoffman it is a way of thinking

> knowing all the philosophy every published is not being a philosopher

Debatable. We may need to ask a philosopher.

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#55
David Chalmers has been doing this for a long time. The fun thing about successful philosophers is it is a very small club and given their nature a lot of them have kind of humorous beef with each other. To make a name for yourself you often have to find a credible target whose intelligence you can insult. This sort of philosophical rivalry is a common historical occurrence as well, and common to the nature of philosophy itself. As such, it feels wrong to mention Chalmers without mentioning some of his famous detractors.

Personally, I miss when Dennett was around to tell Chalmers he was being annoying. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/03/27/daniel-dennett...

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#56
post #38
post #18

"the demand for philosophers with A.I. training is, if anything, outstripping the supply right now. It’s an area I encourage students to go into"... There's about 20 philosophers employed by AI labs worldwide , vs 1000s of software engineers, product managers, designers, etc. There's probably more economists working in these labs than philosophers...

If the AI is digesting all the philosophy material ever published then why do they need philosophers?

Philosophy is a living process of integrating ideas. Classical materials are the whetstone upon which the mind is sharpened. Unlike history, where literal established accounts are ideal, in philosophy one is expected to view today (or the future) through the lens of contextual discourse.

While there is “no right answer” understanding what the issues are and how the discussion plays out is relevant.

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The revenge of the _nearly a dozen_ philosophers.

Philosophy majors. That piece of paper does not make you a philosopher.

Bit of a tangent, but it's fun to think about how much it takes to become a -er, -ian or -ist in a given field. Philosophy is probably one of the hardest, you need to be seen as up there with the all-time greats. In history or physics you probably need to be faculty, in economics you need to have a PhD, in engineering you don't even need a degree but you need to be practicing,...

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#58
post #31

> “Where are they, the great next philosophers, the equivalents of Kant or Wittgenstein or even Aristotle?” the DeepMind co-founder Demis Hassabis wondered on a podcast last year. According to (later) Wittgenstein, philosophy is basically a bad habit that needs breaking.

That's a common misunderstanding of Wittgenstein, and it's intellectually lazy.

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#59
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If pay, hours, benefits, and type of work mean nothing to you, then maybe this is an apt point.

If service to others and to society mean anything to you, working in Starbucks or any fast food job will teach you more about humanity and human society than most college grads learn from a humanities degree.

Helping a mega-corporation make an extra buck is not "service to society".

If you meant doing a service job at a small business, where you can have real ownership over how it treats its customers, I would agree with you.

Re: The revenge of the philosophy majors

#60
I've spent a surprising amount of time reading philosophy of language, and it's probably done more for my AI prompting than most of the "prompt engineering" articles I've read.

Speech Act Theory, Austin's How to Do Things with Words, and Searle's work changed how I think about prompts. Instead of asking, "What words should I use?", I ask, "What action am I trying to perform?" Is this a request? A commitment? A declaration? An instruction? It turns out LLMs respond differently when you think in terms of acts instead of sentences. With AI able to hallucinate context, facts, intent, and answers, keeping AI on track is much like herding cats.

I've been borrowing those ideas for prompts, reusable skills, and even governance. The side effect of making me look smarter than I really am.

I even ended up writing an article about baseball umpires through the lens of Speech Act Theory: https://pitcherlist.com/umpires-dont-make-calls-they-make-hi.... Baseball, as usual, turns out to be an excellent way to explain philosophy. Or philosophy is an excellent way to explain baseball. I'm currently working on a update, since the ABS challenge system helps improve my position.

My suspicion is philosophy has a lot more to offer AI than ethics alone. Philosophy of language seems like an obvious fit, but epistemology ("what does it mean to know?") and philosophy of mind also seem increasingly practical once you're building systems instead of just chatting with them.

Maybe the shortage isn't philosophy majors. Maybe it's people who can translate philosophy into engineering without making everyone read Kant first.

Heavens, that got wordy, sorry about that.

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