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Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

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Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#111
post #76
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI companies are unable to fix the bugs in their own text editors for years… no AI cannot fix bugs, clearly.

Doesn't matter what AI companies do, since AI companies just "move fast and break things" not caring for bug fixing but for iterating quickly on their agents. That's a business decision, not an AI limitation. If you use AI yourself, with a focus on bug fixing and stability, you'll find that AI can fix bugs just fine.

It matters, it shows the limits of the technology, and they have all the interest to showcase how good it is (and are failing to show it can fix bugs)

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so exciting about your software being made of code nobody can or wants to understand?

Can you not see how amazing this is?

A nuclear explosion is amazing, but I won't be excited about the nuke falling on my head.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#113

Lol, all the people squawking about how this means nothing and this is a worthless project amuses me. A lot of people just don't see it yet. This is coming for literally everything and it is so exciting. The next decade is going to be awesome.

You can see it cause...you're a prophet right?

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#114
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can, and they have been doing so. But humans are expensive. Especially smart humans.

Fable is also very expensive, unfortunately. It will be interesting to see how cheap they can make it long term.

Well, so far any gives level of capability has started with (expensive) frontier models, but everyone else, including the cheaper models, usually quickly catches up and the frontier keeps moving forward.

Fable-level capability will most likely be available for pennies soon enough.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#115
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Where's the magic in this project? What's the secret sauce? Someone else paying for the tokens. Also someone seeing it through (should that come). Obviously we're not "at the moment when most of us can ask Fable to implement a custom compiler to a custom target for our favorite language, and even use it as a part of custom solution", without thousands to spare and lots of time to shape the solution.

Even if it does cost thousands (does it? I genuinely have no idea how to scope such a thing) that might be a good price if a custom compiler to your custom target is something you really want. People have paid far more for far less. If you're a hobbyist trying to compile python to your weird little arduino based thing, then that's a lot of money and you would want to use somebody else's solution, no doubt. But if you…

Just eight years ago basically nobody wanted to pay for compilers and developer tooling, and now you're suggesting people will spend a thousand dollars for a compiler they'll have to maintain themselves just because they're willing to pay for AI generated tokens but not for finished tools?

>But if you're an aerospace company trying to compile for a flight control computer (and I guess you really want to use python for some reason), spending thousands of dollars on tokens to make and maintain a custom compiler could represent serious savings.

If you're an aerospace company you're willing to pay thousands of dollars for a compiler, because you need a DO-178C certified toolchain so that you can DO-178C certify the whole airframe. Suggesting AI here tells me you have no clue about the realities of aerospace, because you've just thrown out the entire value proposition of the commercial toolchains.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#116
post #86
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Reading is hard. It runs and passes the full cpython testsuite, just 5x faster. With AI it's 100x easier to maintain than by hand. It reminds my on pperl. same approach using crane lift. Looks good

Your reply would have been much better without the first line [0] > Please don't comment on whether someone read an article. "Did you even read the article? It mentions that" can be shortened to "The article mentions that" [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

No, it wouldn't, because he didn't actually read the readme which clearly states that they are still working on passing the CPython test suite and that 5x performance is an aspirational goal, not something they accomplished yet.

>What is explicitly not done yet — this is the active roadmap, in order:

>CPython test suite (cpython-full): the standing grind; failures are clustered and burned down per wave.

>Stdlib build-out: _io/os, math/struct/random, collections/itertools/json, datetime, importlib parity — each lands as a native module plus a differential corpus module.

>Performance ratchets: tagged small-int flip, TLAB allocation, dict fast paths, float unboxing, call/attribute specialization, generator tiering — toward the ≥5× CPython geomean target (numerics ≥20×).

>AoT parity growth toward the full corpus, plus single-binary product polish.

>No-GIL/free-threaded runtime hardening: thread/GC/signal stress is now on the default runtime path, with remaining gaps tracked by the ratcheted suites.

Overall the substantial parts of his comment are completely wrong and the subjective parts are not much better

>With AI it's 100x easier to maintain than by hand.

This is an unsubstantiated opinion. In practice AI has a limit well below 100x.

>It reminds my on pperl. same approach using crane lift. Looks good

The only thing I can find on the internet that mentions "pperl" is this https://metacpan.org/pod/PPerl

>This program turns ordinary perl scripts into long running daemons, making subsequent executions extremely fast. It forks several processes for each script, allowing many proceses to call the script at once.

Which sounds nothing like pon, which is heavily inspired by bun. Meanwhile if it's this: https://perl.petamem.com/ which took quite a while to find, then I'm wondering why that would have precedence over bun?

Once you add the first sentence, it basically turns into a negative value comment that shouldn't have been posted.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#118

Lol, all the people squawking about how this means nothing and this is a worthless project amuses me. A lot of people just don't see it yet. This is coming for literally everything and it is so exciting. The next decade is going to be awesome.

Most of the value proposition of Python is that it calls into fast native modules. Compiling Python itself helps a little, but it isn't that big of a deal. The most prominent Python JITs have been a failure because of the tight coupling between CPython and native modules.

Basically the entire Python ecosystem has deep integration into implementation details of CPython, if there was a runtime independent api like HPy, then the effort would be better spent migrating to it rather than building yet another half baked JIT.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#119
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a fan of AI assistance, but “ratchet” is pretty much a Claude giveaway. The kids, now in their twenties because the reference is dated, might make a joke here.

It says ratchet so much. Yeah that's pretty ratchet. Idk what it even means for some of those usages.

Ahh, AI. All ratchet and clank.

Re: Python 3.14 compiled to metal – no interpreter

#120
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> when it's vibed it works, until it doesn't and then it's really hard to make it work again Is it? People have solved AI bugs with AI. If some vibe project eventually hits some bug and stops working, what exactly stops using AI to fix it? Is the idea that bugs will go beyond the limits of AI capability? If you meant to say that when an AI vibe coded project beyond some complexity it's difficult for a human coder to…

AI will simply code you into an architectural corner where you can’t get out of without a refactor.

Not if you give it guidance for the architecture and don't just blindly let it one-shot after one-shot of huge chunks of the program.

Besides, AI can also be told to do the refactor.

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