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Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

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Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#361

Post by warumdarum »

tpm wrote: post #255
warumdarum wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The regulation from Europe is worse. They literally use satellite pictures to check and fine farmers..

No the regulation "from Europe" whatever that means is not worse, that's just the usual dumb anti-EU propaganda. If by that you perhaps mean checking EU agro subsidies against the actual size and use of declared fields, then that is not regulation, it's just checking the subsidies are not defrauded, which is a huge issue. Every farmer is free not to ask for the subsidies. But for most of the EU regs, the member count…

I wish you would have to life one with that bureaucratic nightmare / crony employment program that you put on your fellow human. I have no stronger curse.. The eu had one job - to protect europe, from war, from statesized companies like china and get it competitive again before the innovators take itall. It has failed in all fields.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#362

Post by NelsonMinar »

gosub100 wrote: post #271
NelsonMinar wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I realize as a Californian we may not count as "American" in this particular zeitgeist stereotype. But FWIW we have a firework ban in Nevada County that is widely respected. There are very few violations and the law is actively enforced. The difference is we are in a no-joke dangerous fire situation and everyone recognizes it. Most people know better than to set off incendiary explosives in a forest. Anyone who shot…

It's funny that CAs own "environmental" laws actually created the tinder box conditions in the forest. So their solution is more laws, of course.

The premise of this statement is wrong.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#363

Post by aidenn0 »

waltbosz wrote: post #349
rbanffy wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a bit surprised someone with a house placed like your uncle would feel it’s ok to light up fireworks under an airport approach path.

From his house, no I don't think a consumer mortar could hit a plane. The planes weren't that low. But the area surrounding the airport is very densely populated. Given all those people, I'm not surprised some dumb kid (or adult) lit fireworks near the airport. Also, most fireworks are illegal in Illinois. But it's only a 30 minute drive from Chicago to Indiana.

I haven't lived in Indiana in over 20 years, but is the law for mortars still:

Legal to posses

Legal to buy and sell

Not legal to use

That was always a bit silly to me. Stores would even have you sign a waiver that you weren't going to use them in Indiana.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#364

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

chainingsolid wrote: post #347
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was talking to someone that hosts commercial-grade fireworks, every year, in his backyard. He said the trick is to invite a couple of cops.

The "trick" I've seen is just doing it with enough space to be safe and with property owner permission. The cops are likely caring about safety not the letter of culturally unenforceable law on July 4th. Problem is this don't work in the suburbs and cities, it's just to dense.

We are very much in the suburbs. It can get crazy.

If you have a cop or two at the party, and, often, a volly firefighter running the sparks, it seems to be OK.

A few years ago, one of our neighbors was running one, and a mortar fired into his second story. It was a 5-alarm fire.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#365

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

ryandrake wrote: post #351
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rules come from lawsuits. When you can get sued, safety fences get put up, quite quickly. America has very aggressive lawyers. We live in a country, where being stupid, can be financially rewarding.

The threat of getting sued only motivates people with something to lose. If we let lawsuits largely drive what the rules are, how do you govern people who are so poor they are "judgement-proof."

True, but this is how it actually works, in the US.

Lots of stuff is not anywhere close to ideal, but it is what it is.

people refusing to understand that, doesn't help. Change usually comes from people who first, understand and accept, then they know what to do, to actually make change, as opposed to tilting at windmills.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#366

Post by IAmBroom »

billfor wrote: post #140
greggoB wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> one of them had a seizure It's insane to me how much dogs are supposedly loved by such a large chunk of the pop, and yet people proceed to go apeshit with fireworks fully knowing how badly this affects them.

Most dogs in my neighborhood are ok with them. My own dog loves them. I try to keep him inside only because I think it might be bad for his hearing if he gets too close. Beyond basic temperament I wonder if owner training is implicated, as more people become annoyed by fireworks they don’t expose the dog to them at a young age.

How on earth would you even presume to know this?

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#367

Post by IAmBroom »

quailfarmer wrote: post #223
inigyou wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you set off a firework in front of a cop to protest fireworks being illegal, that would be illegal and you'd go to jail

But if you arrest him, I’m going to set off fireworks in protest. The market of stubbornness can remain solvent for a long time.

Classic Internet Tough Guy boast. Imagine thinking that, when the police come to fine you, your neighbors will break the law in front of the police "to show them!". Your neighbors may be just smart enough to not invite the police to fine them, too.

The "market of stubbornness" is about one deep at any given moment.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#368

Post by lwansbrough »

inigyou wrote: post #260
quailfarmer wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if you arrest him, I’m going to set off fireworks in protest. The market of stubbornness can remain solvent for a long time.

Cops have arrest quotas to meet - they don't mind arresting you too.

They actually do mind, which is why they don’t do it. Did you forget the reality of the situation?

They mind because they are completely outnumbered. Policing only works if you can point out a small minority and say “these people are causing harm to the majority of us”. With something like fireworks (or cannabis protests in many places) the police are severely outnumbered and they don’t have enough room in their jails anyway.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#369

Post by klaff »

jandrewrogers wrote: post #133
msisk6 wrote: post #63

I recently moved to the St. Louis area for a software job at Boeing. I'm actually in a nice quiet neighborhood in St. Charles right under the flight path for planes landing at Lambert Field. The fireworks last night were insane. All around me folks were setting off commercial grade fireworks bursting hundreds of feet in the air. The house was shaking, my dogs were freaking out, one of them had a seizure. The air was…

40-50 years ago, fireworks were largely unregulated across the US and were a major part of the 4th of July cultural experience. Dangerous, slightly reckless, and incredibly fun. I have fond memories of this as a child. It is a big part of American culture, like turkey on Thanksgiving. Every country has rules that exist but which are culturally unenforceable. Today, fireworks are outlawed in much of the US because saf…

I don't agree. I think it's a choice that each area has made between law enforcement and local governance. Regarding the St. Louis area, it really depends on which jurisdiction you are in. St. Louis County has over 90 municipalities. The neighboring counties are also fragmented but to a lesser degree. There are areas (mostly more rural) where it is legal and loud, some where it's not legal but enforcement is lacking, and there are quiet areas in which I assume enforcement does happen.

Re: Delta flight hit by firework while landing at Midway Airport on Fourth of July

#370

Post by Xirdus »

pandaman wrote: post #253
Xirdus wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Stealing electricity is already illegal. So is shooting a house with fireworks. I'm against a general ban on doingelectrical work yourself, and against a general ban on fireworks.

Where I live, it's already illegal to shoot fireworks in the city limits, people still do that. Banning sales and importation is the next logical step.

According to what logic?
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