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EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

heise.de

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Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#51

Post by [deleted] »

m132 wrote: post #48
kingleopold wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they dont investigate themselves, I hope you understand those details some day.

They do, albeit it's a slow process: - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pfizergate - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/eu-secret-gr... Ironically, those are two separate cases of one high-profile EU politician (in fact, the very head of the same parliament that pushes for mass scanning of private messages) BOTH involving secret text messages that the mentioned politician refuses to reveal.

[deleted]

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#52

Post by theodric »

SilverElfin wrote: post #38

Governments don’t work for people. Yet they use terms like democracy all the time. The repeated attempts at chat control are so blatantly anti civil rights but also disrespectful of democratic principles. Why do EU citizens tolerate this? Are they okay being made a fool of or is this just not an issue for them after all?

How do you suggest people be intolerant? Essentially all the parties work toward these goals, so voting is ineffective. Speech is (more-or-less) allowed until it turns into strident protest, at which point the water cannons are brought out and a few token agitators are prosecuted for their instigation. I wouldn't want to call this tyranny, because I might get a knock on the door.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#53

Post by SilverElfin »

theodric wrote: post #52
SilverElfin wrote: post #38

Governments don’t work for people. Yet they use terms like democracy all the time. The repeated attempts at chat control are so blatantly anti civil rights but also disrespectful of democratic principles. Why do EU citizens tolerate this? Are they okay being made a fool of or is this just not an issue for them after all?

How do you suggest people be intolerant? Essentially all the parties work toward these goals, so voting is ineffective. Speech is (more-or-less) allowed until it turns into strident protest, at which point the water cannons are brought out and a few token agitators are prosecuted for their instigation. I wouldn't want to call this tyranny, because I might get a knock on the door.

Why not emphasize the issue of civil rights and make it disqualifying as a single issue for any politician? At least online it feels like people care about chat control a lot but when it comes to voting, the type of dystopian control EU bureaucrats are building isn’t in anyone’s mind. So politicians can get away with supporting those policies since there isn’t a consequence for them.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#54

Post by Lio »

petcat wrote: post #7

Am I crazy or is this website not allowing me to opt out of cookie tracking unless I sign up for a subscription? I know the EU cookie banners have basically ruined the internet, but this seems like a whole 'nother level of obnoxious.

It's not EU cookie banners that have ruined the internet, it's malicious compliance and dark pattens on behalf of those that want to track you.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#55

Post by tokai »

joe_mamba wrote: post #42
m132 wrote: post #27

The central bank, council, and commission have to get thoroughly investigated. The amount of questionable decisions coming from those three in the recent (15) years is extremely unsettling. The parliament and courts are practically the only institutions preventing things from hitting the fan at this point, and struggling to do so, it seems.

>The central bank, council, and commission have to get thoroughly investigated. By WHO?! They are THE (unelected) ruling elite. Who's gonna prosecute them?

OLAF I would assume.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#56

Post by surgical_fire »

joe_mamba wrote: post #42
m132 wrote: post #27

The central bank, council, and commission have to get thoroughly investigated. The amount of questionable decisions coming from those three in the recent (15) years is extremely unsettling. The parliament and courts are practically the only institutions preventing things from hitting the fan at this point, and struggling to do so, it seems.

>The central bank, council, and commission have to get thoroughly investigated. By WHO?! They are THE (unelected) ruling elite. Who's gonna prosecute them?

They are not unelected. The EU Council is made up of the head of government of each member state. They are all elected.

The commissioners are picked by the heads of state (elected) and the EU parliament (also elected).

This does not absolve them from wrongdoing, but you should understand where your complaints should be directed at.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#57

Post by jwr »

petcat wrote: post #7

Am I crazy or is this website not allowing me to opt out of cookie tracking unless I sign up for a subscription? I know the EU cookie banners have basically ruined the internet, but this seems like a whole 'nother level of obnoxious.

As a reminder "EU cookie banners" are not required if you use cookies for site functionality. They are only required if your site uses these to track users.

This needs repeating, it's a common misconception (deliberately spread by many, too) that the EU requires cookie banners for all cookies.

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#58

Post by [deleted] »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #18
sph wrote: post #11

This is democracy manifest. What a joke.

It is a bit strange why EU countries allow their own credibility and legitimacy get steadily dragged down, bit by bit, by all these thousands of dubious statements, tricks, manoeuvres, and so on. Do they just not care about weakening their own societies?

[deleted]

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#59

Post by flumpcakes »

neobrain wrote: post #49

For context, this refers to "Chat Control 1.0", allowing facebook and other messaging providers to scan chats for harmful content (which they had been temporarily allowed to do by a recently expired law). This is still problematic, but the far more dangerous Chat Control 2.0 that would weaken end-to-end-encrypted messengers like Signal is not being discussed here. Not to diminish the gravity of the new development, b…

Isn't this something they already do?

I would be utterly shocked if facebook et al. were not scanning all of your messages (either in transit or at terminus to get around 'E2E' claims).

Re: EU Council forces Chat Control via fast-track

#60

Post by theodric »

MichaelZuo wrote: post #18
sph wrote: post #11

This is democracy manifest. What a joke.

It is a bit strange why EU countries allow their own credibility and legitimacy get steadily dragged down, bit by bit, by all these thousands of dubious statements, tricks, manoeuvres, and so on. Do they just not care about weakening their own societies?

They hold all the cards, and have means - above-board or questionable, but effective nonetheless - to enact their will. Do you remember the Treaty of Lisbon referendumS, plural? Just keep asking the question until the plebs answer correctly.
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