Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming • Hacker News Board

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#51

Post by zerocrates » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:26 AM UTC

conartist6 wrote: post #43

qjack wrote: post #38

The most dumbfounding thing in all of this is the number of people interacting directly with Jimmy Wales on twitter and having no sense for how wikipedia works or why. It should not be surprising that a company webpage or even the CEO confirming the fact are insufficient sources. If wikipedia did accept this, they would just be a place for people to make self-reported baseless claims. There's already a place for that…

I dunno I just find it silly because they're making such a Thing out of it that soon there's just gonna be a Wikipedia page on Odingate as it is rapidly becoming a notable public event of its own. Then that page will have to link to a page on Odin anyway

The hypothetical "Odingate" article in a reliable source would probably have to discuss Odin enough to also be a viable source for Odin itself; problem solved.

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#52

Post by krautsauer » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:27 AM UTC

dibujaron wrote: post #5

This article makes Odin sound extremely well-known. I've never heard of it before, and I feel like I keep up with programming topics pretty diligently. Admittedly I don't work at the systems programming layer, but I've definitely heard plenty about Rust and c++ topics. Curious if others feel similarly, or maybe I just happened to miss it?

It's been here a few times, maybe 4-6 times in the past year?

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#53

Post by boca_honey » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:35 AM UTC

I know programming is what's most important to many in this community, but as an outsider I need to ask: literally WTF is Odin? I mean I know about Java and C++, etc. But Odin? That's what Wikipedia policies are for. It cannot include anything and everything about every single profession, subculture, or interest group.

An anime community would complain that a very influential (but largely unknown and mostly lost) OVA from 1987 should have its own article. A Peruvian community could argue that one of its most celebrated local activists should have his own article. Of course they would, but how could Wikipedia know they are really what they claim if there isn't a standard of what a credible/respectable source is?

That being said, Wikipedia editors are just Reddit mods with delusions of grandeur, so anything that brings them down is fine by me. Grokpedia has the right idea... I actually think that's the future. Too bad it's controlled by a grifting manchild.

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#54

Post by dismalaf » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:39 AM UTC

calvinmorrison wrote: post #34

dismalaf wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zig is more popular. Name a second modern "C competitor" language that's more popular?

golang, rust, c++... etc?

The whole "C competitor" category is about minimalism so no one puts Rust or C++ in that category. Also Golang has a GC so most wouldn't even call it a systems language at all...

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#55

Post by wmorgan » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:39 AM UTC

qjack wrote: post #38

The most dumbfounding thing in all of this is the number of people interacting directly with Jimmy Wales on twitter and having no sense for how wikipedia works or why. It should not be surprising that a company webpage or even the CEO confirming the fact are insufficient sources. If wikipedia did accept this, they would just be a place for people to make self-reported baseless claims. There's already a place for that…

FYI a tertiary source aggregates both primary and secondary sources. When you read the plot summary of a movie on Wikipedia, for example, that summary cites a primary source, that is the movie itself. It's allowed to cite primary sources but there's guidance on how to be careful about it.

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#56

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:40 AM UTC

krautsauer wrote: post #48

conartist6 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno I just find it silly because they're making such a Thing out of it that soon there's just gonna be a Wikipedia page on Odingate as it is rapidly becoming a notable public event of its own. Then that page will have to link to a page on Odin anyway

Link will be red?

[deleted]

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#57

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:40 AM UTC

dibujaron wrote: post #5

This article makes Odin sound extremely well-known. I've never heard of it before, and I feel like I keep up with programming topics pretty diligently. Admittedly I don't work at the systems programming layer, but I've definitely heard plenty about Rust and c++ topics. Curious if others feel similarly, or maybe I just happened to miss it?

[deleted]

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#58

Post by brendoelfrendo » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:41 AM UTC

andai wrote: post #8

If I've got this right: programming these days -- especially niche areas -- meshes poorly with Wikipedia's guidelines on reliable sources and notability, which were designed mostly with traditional media in mind. e.g. a company saying they use a language is not considered a good source because it's a primary source? Not sure if I'm getting that part right. The most interesting part to me: Wikipedia has a bunch of lan…

Generally speaking, encyclopedias are tertiary sources, so that makes sense (though the line between secondary and tertiary sources is sometimes blurry)... but as you say, there are plenty of topics (a niche programming language under active development primarily by one guy is a good example) where the topic might be notable enough to warrant a Wikipedia article but not widely discussed enough to have a good source other than the primary developer. I understand that "well the guy who made it said it" sounds like an obvious argument, but I also understand that Wikipedia is trying to maintain their role as an encyclopedia first and foremost. I'm not sure what the optimal path is.

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#59

Post by 3836293648 » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:55 AM UTC

dibujaron wrote: post #5

This article makes Odin sound extremely well-known. I've never heard of it before, and I feel like I keep up with programming topics pretty diligently. Admittedly I don't work at the systems programming layer, but I've definitely heard plenty about Rust and c++ topics. Curious if others feel similarly, or maybe I just happened to miss it?

I think you just happened to miss it. It's very commonly mentioned in the new systems space, alongside Jonathan Blow's jai.

Re: Odin, Wikipedia and engagement farming

#60

Post by fwipsy » Sat, Jul 04, 2026, 1:59 AM UTC

staplung wrote: post #44

I'm not sure I understand why even a truly obscure programming language article should ever be deleted; it's not like Wikipedia is running low on paper. If Odin ceased all development tomorrow it would be good to have some record of what it was. For the record, I like Odin. (On homebrew it appears to have been downloaded 6,707 in the past year. Compare to:) zig: 71,565 rust: 304,405 golang: 1,246,300 malbogle: 9

The point of Wikipedia is to be accurate, not complete. Wikipedia does not want to just trust the developers of $ObscureLang to maintain their own wikipedia page. So, the existence of the $ObscureLang page (and, in the aggregate, many similar pages) imposes a maintenance burden on Wikipedia. Better to say nothing than to risk saying something inaccurate.