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Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

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Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Essentially all commercial apple trees are grafted and don't reproduce true to seed. Been this way for almost a century now.

Them doing it for a certain amount of time does not make it any less egregious. I'm not sure if you're just stating fact or wanting to use it as a rebuttal. I hope the former.

The reality is that it’s not as clear cut like “X is bad/Y is good” as laypeople in this thread assume

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#92
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, there should be no excess that needs to be disposed. if you produce excess you should reduce production.

A state of "excess production" can only be determined long after production parameters have already been committed to. Yields, logistics costs, and market capacity aren't knowable ahead of time.

sure, but the market consequence to overproduction is that the price goes down. if you are not allowed to destroy products just to keep the price up then you will self correct in time.

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#93
post #13

regardless of how the contract is structured, no contract should allow or force a producer to throw products away. this is similar to a law in the EU that forbids producers or distributors of clothing to destroy products they don't want to sell. once you plant a tree to grow fruit you should be allowed to keep harvesting that tree until its natural end. if there is an exclusive contract then the contract must not be…

The optimal quantity of discarded food is not zero.

true. but there is a difference between discarding food that has gone bad because you could not sell it, and discarding it without even trying to sell it because some exclusive contract prevents you from selling, or because you want to keep the price artificially high.

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#94
post #83
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Strawman if I ever saw one.

Really? How? Has Monsanto used its termination patents?

>> These people are evil.

> So you want to kill them?

If you're being serious, saying "there is a special place in hell" does not equal "let's send them there".

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#95
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, and there is a special place in hell reserved for anyone involved in designing food crops that can’t reproduce.

Essentially all commercial apple trees are grafted and don't reproduce true to seed. Been this way for almost a century now.

It's been that way forever. No apple reproduces true to seed, period. 400 years ago, if you wanted another of your apple tree, you grafted it.

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#96
post #6

Patents on food crops, even genetically engineered ones, are evil. ALL our staple food crops and most non staples are genetically engineered by millennia of cultivation and selective breeding; CRISPR is just a fancy mechanism for what we’ve always done to food. Regulations that prevent farmers from selling food that is safe, are evil. It doesn’t matter how well intentioned the regulation is. Any government functionar…

only thing I can say is that patents, unlike copyrights, seem to continue to expire in less than a lifetime (20 years).

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite what everyone is assuming, this case doesn't depend on patents. The farmer entered into an agreement with another company and they're locked in a legal battle about that agreement. > Fresno County Superior Court Judge Jon Skiles in May ruled that Giumarra’s breach of contract claim can go forward, saying that the agreement between Giumarra and Mora is valid whether there is a patent for the fruit or not. > “T…

Correct, many people get worked up over the idea of the patents that could be in play here; plenty of good reason when that is a consideration. The court has already decided that the existence of a patent or licensing agreement is not relevant; It’s a contract dispute.

I’d still make the same argument- the remedy should be monetary damages, not enjoinder. Produce had a short shelf life; enjoinder has the same effect on the farmer as a loss in court, only before the trial. The other party to the contract can be made whole later, if victorious, via monetary damages.

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#98
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you bar a contract for the productivity of a tree for a given period of time, with a clause dictating how excess produce is to be disposed of?

yes, there should be no excess that needs to be disposed. if you produce excess you should reduce production.

So should they ask the trees to fruit less, or cut them down knowing they can't get them back online for 10 years?

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#99
post #94
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? How? Has Monsanto used its termination patents?

>> These people are evil. > So you want to kill them? If you're being serious, saying "there is a special place in hell" does not equal "let's send them there".

True, he's not suggesting that they be sent prematurely, just that they should endure eternal torture afterwards. That seems harsh for growing a seedless grape.

Re: Farmer, marketer at odds over sales of white nectarines

#100
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> These people are evil. > So you want to kill them? If you're being serious, saying "there is a special place in hell" does not equal "let's send them there".

True, he's not suggesting that they be sent prematurely, just that they should endure eternal torture afterwards. That seems harsh for growing a seedless grape.

People also say things in ways not to be taken super literally. "There's a special place in hell" is an idiom.

> Said of a person whom one considers to be especially wicked, evil, malevolent, etc. Often used facetiously or sarcastically.

From: https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/there's+a+special+place...

So they're not really saying this either:

> just that they should endure eternal torture afterwards

They're really just saying, "these people are evil/wicked".

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