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Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

cnbc.com

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Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#161

Post by piva00 »

xienze wrote: post #67
petesergeant wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a shakedown. Nothing more. Perhaps believable, had it not survived eight years of litigation ending at the ECJ, or had there been some informal "pay up or else" demand attached, neither of which is true.

> Perhaps believable, had it not survived eight years of litigation ending at the ECJ You're of course making the assumption the ECJ isn't biased towards ruling in favor of the EU in these disputes... > or had there been some informal "pay up or else" demand attached, neither of which is true. Isn't there a formal "pay up or else" demand attached? If Google doesn't pay, then what? I would take this a lot more serious…

The fine is not a one-and-done like fines are levied against corporations in the USA, most fines against corporations in the EU can be levied many times if the infringing behaviour is not corrected.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#162

Post by fartcoin67 »

sylware wrote: post #128
lukan wrote: post #4

“Android provides more choice for everyone and supports thousands of businesses. This judgment fails to recognize our significant investment to ensure Android remains open, interoperable and free,” a Google spokesperson told CNBC. Sure. Which is why alternative stores like F-Droid are under threat now. https://keepandroidopen.org/

Why I cannot send email from my self-hosted, no dns, servers to gmail? email addresses with IP literals are much stronger than SPF (email is dropped if the IP of the SMTP client does not match the IP literal in the envelope and in all appropriate 'from' headers). I cannot browse youtube with a noscript/basic HTML browser (basic HTML element). It is not enough, much more is needed to make those companies behave.

[dead]

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#163

Post by graemep »

plantain wrote: post #155
lopis wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So much happened since 2018 that this ruling feels ancient now. It was about Google making unfair deals with OEMs: > In 2018, the European Commission slapped Google with the record-breaking penalty on the grounds that it abused Android’s mobile dominance to give unfair advantage to its own apps via pre-installation deals with smartphone makers. While this specific problem is much better today, specially since of the…

If only this was applied evenly. Why is every Samsung/LG/literally every non-Pixel device full of uninstallable crapware?

None of those companies have the market power Google does.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#164

Post by cbg0 »

watwut wrote: post #142
bilekas wrote: post #8

> the U.S. ambassador to the EU Andrew Puzder told CNBC that Europe “can’t over regulate” and hit companies with “huge fines” if it is going to participate in the AI economy I love how the US will just let companies walk all over their citizens and then criticize others for not letting it happen. "Please think of the poor multi billion dollar companies".

Notice how HN people talk about it - companies breaking laws and defrauding are framed as "risk taking" and those following the law "risk averse". It is about "legal risk". They dont see any value in "doing the right thing" if the right thing dont earn money and power. They cant even imagine a person doing the right thing for any reason other then being afraid.

This approach is more US-centric than "HN people". I've heard this often with phrases like "better to ask for forgiveness than for permission" which is probably because you can get away with a lot more on the business side in the US without having personal accountability.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#165

Post by graemep »

petcat wrote: post #115
PurpleRamen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU can live fine without US cloud services, and it's not very dependent on AI at the moment. If access would be cut off, companies would just switch to other solutions, which BTW are already there. The question is more how much time they would have to switch and adapt. An unannounced zero-day cut off would be of course harmful for a while (days, weeks, maybe months), but on most parts could be probably solved in a sh…

The EU is doing the exact opposite of switching away from US tech. In fact they just announced that the new EU digital ID wallet is going to require Google or Apple device attestation. That is two US companies in complete control of the fundamental digital ID system of the entire EU. Everything they say about "digital sovereignty" is performative nonsense because they simply have no other options and no capacity to b…

The EU and most of the rest of the world.

The UK is talking about sovereign AI but doing much the same with pushing reliance on Apple and Google.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#166

Post by 9dev »

dylan604 wrote: post #156
petcat wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> take a decade More like several decades and 100s of billions of euros which nobody is going to pay. It will simply never happen and right now all the politicians are just quietly waiting for this whole thing to blow over.

> More like several decades and 100s of billions of euros which nobody is going to pay And now you know where that $4.7B fine will be spent. Why spend your own money when you can spend someone else’s?

> Why spend your own money when you can spend someone else’s?

Funny you would say that in defence of giant mega-corporations, externalising huge chunks of the cost they generate to the rest of the world. OpenAI decided to run the largest social experiment humanity ever undertook without asking any of us. Microsoft is powering up old nuclear power plants to cover for their AI data center consumption. Apple is manufacturing in foreign countries under awful conditions so every American child can own an iPhone. Big Tech made San Francisco unaffordable even for well-compensated software engineers. Facebook actively made children addicted to push more apps.

We all, as a society, have to suffer through the effects of reckless greed from American companies (and we didn't even talk about Big Oil or Big Pharma yet!) Just because nobody bothers to put a price tag on it doesn't mean there isn't one.

The EU doesn't fine companies as a way to generate revenue, but because they break local laws and cause damages to someone.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#168

Post by eastbound »

hnfong wrote: post #141
bfjvibybd6cuvu6 wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's factually and flagrantly incorrect. > Contempt of court is a legal offense that occurs when an individual or organization interferes with the administration of justice or willfully disrespects a court's authority, dignity, or orders.

You can disagree with the judgment as long as you follow the orders.

[flagged]

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#169

Post by nalekberov »

Well, I guess occasional $4.7B fines are just the cost of doing business for Google. They have a monopoly in multiple categories, such as search engine, online advertising and strong dominance in maps and video hosting -- surely at this point money isn't an issue for them anymore.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#170

Post by LoganDark »

Ah, a real slap on the wrist. That'll teach 'em...

In all seriousness we need a couple more orders of magnitude before they'll listen or care.

Google needs to learn being monopolistic and anti-competitive makes less money than playing nice. Otherwise nothing will change.

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