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Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

cnbc.com

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Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#61

Post by RugnirViking »

epolanski wrote: post #33
netcan wrote: post #16

Apologies for the meta: I feel that our understanding of trust and antitrust, along with the legal and regulatory premises... Just isn't very useful in the 21st century. I understand the motivation, and justification for employing antitrust. Google's business model, and much of modern tech economy is really all about Monopoly-like market power. In fact, one of the main concerns for AI investors is price competition,…

> Nothing was really gained by victory Windows users have a prompt to choose their browser after installing the OS.

and you might think this is a small or pointless win, but the whole point of this is that because users have this choice, microsoft is forced to make internet explorer actually good so that people willingly choose it instead of abusing it to make life harder and worse for everyone else while making things easier for themselves.

Hence internet explorer was killed and we got edge

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#62

Post by shevy-java »

throwaw12 wrote: post #11

> U.S. ambassador to the EU Andrew Puzder told CNBC that Europe “can’t over regulate” and hit companies with “huge fines” if it is going to participate in the AI economy. Imagine what these companies are doing in the US to their citizens, if ambassador is ready to defend them for violating rules/laws

Well, he is a corporate tool, aka a lobbyist, so unsurprisingly he acts in favour of companies. The question is why other countries should be subject to that. The EU may succumb to blackmail though, as Ursula showed before when she submitted to Trump.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#63

Post by istoleabread »

abc123abc123 wrote: post #39
9dev wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As he just found out, that's exactly what the EU can do. And as he's about to find out, the EU is way too important a market for the American economy to ignore or pull out of. Play on your neighbour's yard, obey their rules.

I think rather, that it is the EU who cannot live without US cloud services and AI-services. Imagine if the US, behind closed doors of course, threatened to cut off all cloud services. Huge parts of the public and private sector could collapse.

And achieve what exactly? EU being dependent on US cloud services also mean EU being a big part of their revenue. Parts of EU public and private sector may collapse but they will also switch to their own alternatives, the broken trust and lost revenue on the other hand will definitely not be recovered by US companies.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#64

Post by sensanaty »

throwaw12 wrote: post #11

> U.S. ambassador to the EU Andrew Puzder told CNBC that Europe “can’t over regulate” and hit companies with “huge fines” if it is going to participate in the AI economy. Imagine what these companies are doing in the US to their citizens, if ambassador is ready to defend them for violating rules/laws

> ...if it is going to participate in the AI economy.

The US is so thoroughly bought out that your ambassadors are saying embarrassing shit like this, how pathetic

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#66

Post by hparadiz »

abc123abc123 wrote: post #39
9dev wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As he just found out, that's exactly what the EU can do. And as he's about to find out, the EU is way too important a market for the American economy to ignore or pull out of. Play on your neighbour's yard, obey their rules.

I think rather, that it is the EU who cannot live without US cloud services and AI-services. Imagine if the US, behind closed doors of course, threatened to cut off all cloud services. Huge parts of the public and private sector could collapse.

It would hurt the EU more than it would hurt us and they're in denial about it.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#67

Post by xienze »

petesergeant wrote: post #37
hparadiz wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's literally what is happening here. It's a shakedown. Nothing more.

> It's a shakedown. Nothing more. Perhaps believable, had it not survived eight years of litigation ending at the ECJ, or had there been some informal "pay up or else" demand attached, neither of which is true.

> Perhaps believable, had it not survived eight years of litigation ending at the ECJ

You're of course making the assumption the ECJ isn't biased towards ruling in favor of the EU in these disputes...

> or had there been some informal "pay up or else" demand attached, neither of which is true.

Isn't there a formal "pay up or else" demand attached? If Google doesn't pay, then what? I would take this a lot more seriously if the EU said "look, these violations are so egregious we simply can't trust you to operate in the EU anymore." No, they're OK with Google apparently not changing much of anything and being allowed to continue operating so long as they pay the fine first.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#68

Post by hparadiz »

f6v wrote: post #55
w3ll_w3ll_w3ll wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We would build our own alternatives. Russia is a much smaller market (120 million people) and they have their own tech companies.

> We would build our own alternatives. Right, and we haven’t because we just don’t wanna? The gap between US/China and the EU in AI is becoming wider by the day. Russia has like 3-4 large tech companies (Sber, Yandex, VK, and maybe Ozon). And they completely rely on foreign hardware. I don’t even want to imagine how could Russia start building frontier AI in these circumstances.

It's actually pretty sad for the EU that the biggest tech company names on the continent are all Russian.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#69

Post by maligenligen »

f6v wrote: post #55
w3ll_w3ll_w3ll wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We would build our own alternatives. Russia is a much smaller market (120 million people) and they have their own tech companies.

> We would build our own alternatives. Right, and we haven’t because we just don’t wanna? The gap between US/China and the EU in AI is becoming wider by the day. Russia has like 3-4 large tech companies (Sber, Yandex, VK, and maybe Ozon). And they completely rely on foreign hardware. I don’t even want to imagine how could Russia start building frontier AI in these circumstances.

We hadn't because we didn't have to.

Re: Google loses fight over record $4.7B EU antitrust fine

#70

Post by petesergeant »

f6v wrote: post #55
w3ll_w3ll_w3ll wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We would build our own alternatives. Russia is a much smaller market (120 million people) and they have their own tech companies.

> We would build our own alternatives. Right, and we haven’t because we just don’t wanna? The gap between US/China and the EU in AI is becoming wider by the day. Russia has like 3-4 large tech companies (Sber, Yandex, VK, and maybe Ozon). And they completely rely on foreign hardware. I don’t even want to imagine how could Russia start building frontier AI in these circumstances.

> Right, and we haven’t because we just don’t wanna?

The EU hasn't because European investors are shy about deploying capital. If you look at European weapons and aerospace, it's clear there's no particular technical or capability barrier.

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