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Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

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Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#21

Post by flexagoon »

johncoltrane wrote: post #10
JdeBP wrote: post #4

Yes, hjkl navigation is certainly one of the things that should learn about a vi clone. But are novices well served, in the 2020s, by that being the primary thing that they learn before anything else? This is not a criticism of this WWW site specifically. The VIM doco has the same priorities, teaching hjkl navigation before arrow keys. (So do nvi2 and NeoVIM.) The problem is that the received wisdom, that arrow keys…

hjkl are more of a cult/status thing anyway because they are not _that_ touch-typing-friendly to begin with, and they suck just as much as the cursor keys for moving the cursor around. Insisting so much on hjkl is silly. No one is using an ADM-3A in 2026, so the official documentation should let users use the more intuitive cursor keys and downgrade hjkl to what they have always been since vi: __ham-fisted alternativ…

How are they "not that touch-typing-friendly" when they're literally the keys that are always under your fingers when touch typing?

Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#22

Post by zavec »

tokamak-teapot wrote: post #8
JdeBP wrote: post #4

Yes, hjkl navigation is certainly one of the things that should learn about a vi clone. But are novices well served, in the 2020s, by that being the primary thing that they learn before anything else? This is not a criticism of this WWW site specifically. The VIM doco has the same priorities, teaching hjkl navigation before arrow keys. (So do nvi2 and NeoVIM.) The problem is that the received wisdom, that arrow keys…

The reasons I still use vi-style editing in editors are: 1. Efficiency, so I can be fast 2. Minimal stretching and whole-hand movement, so I don't get painful wrists and so I can be accurate. Using a keyboard's arrow keys doesn't fit with 2.

I always wonder about the choice of hjkl, because don't people normally rest their hands one row to the left, on jkl;?

Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#23

Post by greengreengrass »

Neat, but the (presumably AI-generated) provenance of this means it has regrettable gaps and errors:

On "There and back", it says par is 6 – it's solvable in 4.

On "Rush hour", it describes an invalid motion 'r': "type a number first to repeat a command, e.g. 3j or 4r"

It isn't clear why certain motions are being introduced where they aren't relevant, and therefore aren't going to be immediately practised at point of introduction – "Rush hour" introduces gg to go home, but then doesn't need it.

If I'm going to use something to practice and hone my vim motion, I'm going to need it to be an accurate resource. I closed it at this point.

Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#24

Post by sudahtigabulan »

zavec wrote: post #22
tokamak-teapot wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reasons I still use vi-style editing in editors are: 1. Efficiency, so I can be fast 2. Minimal stretching and whole-hand movement, so I don't get painful wrists and so I can be accurate. Using a keyboard's arrow keys doesn't fit with 2.

I always wonder about the choice of hjkl, because don't people normally rest their hands one row to the left, on jkl;?

It has to do with the codes these keys (used to) emit in combination with Ctrl:

  Ctrl/H - Backspace
  Ctrl/J - Line Feed
  Ctrl/K - Upline
  Ctrl/L - Forward Space
Source - the ADM-3A operator's manual, page 3-5:

https://archive.org/download/lear-siegler-adm-3-a/Lear_Siegl...

Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#26

Post by marcusmichaels »

greengreengrass wrote: post #23

Neat, but the (presumably AI-generated) provenance of this means it has regrettable gaps and errors: On "There and back", it says par is 6 – it's solvable in 4. On "Rush hour", it describes an invalid motion 'r': "type a number first to repeat a command, e.g. 3j or 4r" It isn't clear why certain motions are being introduced where they aren't relevant, and therefore aren't going to be immediately practised at point of…

Thanks for the feedback, the par is set based on the level, not the absolute best that can be achieved. I added 4r specifically as an example to get across being able to change multiple characters such as XXXX to YYYY.

Though I’m aware some keyboards might not be fully compatible yet so I’ll work on adding wider support.

EDIT: You’re right, I loosely included r but it’s not technically “motion”

Re: Learn Vim motions with an ice-cream van

#28

Post by marcusmichaels »

tidbeck wrote: post #16

I really like this but feels like it does not really work on a Swedish keyboard layout (macOS), cannot input '$'. Tried both Alt+4 (how you actually input '$') which works in vim and Shift+4 (US layout).

Thank you, I’m planning to increase keyboard support. There’s also a few little bugs I need to iron out!
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