Live data from Hacker News

Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

thereallo.dev

741–750 of 817 posts

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#741

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No fire, just people looking for a reason to be upset. "They didn't tell us they were secretly checking for ToS violations" is their reason this time.

It is not checking that is the problem, it is sending obfuscated information about the user without disclosure. That is unacceptable in any context, let alone a tool that requires an unprecedented level of trust.

I mean in the end they could have got all this info from IP + headers + API key right? So what is the issue?

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#742
post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Legal vs "They aren't going to let you do it with their service" are two different things.

Screw those poor copyright holders without the means to stop frontier AI labs, amirite?

>Screw those poor copyright holders

In general yes. Cut it down to a reasonable amount of time and I'll care a whole lot more about those 'rights' holders.

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#743

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Slipper slope is always a fallacy. It works as a metaphor, and as a rhetorical device, but the fact that it’s possible to construct a gradient from heaven to hell is not proof that each step in the gradient is inevitable. It’s a good way to illustrate a potential bad path. But I can construct a slippery slope from commenting on HN to making bioweapons. That should not be seen as evidence that HN commenters are likely…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope In a slippery-slope argument, a course of action is rejected because the slippery slope advocate believes it will lead to a chain reaction resulting in an undesirable end or ends. The core of the slippery slope argument is that a specific decision under debate is likely to result in unintended consequences. The strength of such an argument depends on whether the small step…

No longer slandered as a fallacy in the lede :) the 2019 version:

  A slippery slope argument (SSA), in logic, critical thinking, political rhetoric, and caselaw, is a logical fallacy in which a party asserts that a relatively small first step leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant (usually negative) effect.
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Slippery_slope&ol...

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#744
post #740

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That they have a process for doing evil things doesn't make it less nefarious.

If we define evil as a company having a strategy to deal with a competitive threat, then many/most companies in the world are evil.

Only corporate apologists would come up with a definition of evil so useless for anything other than making strawman arguments. The criteria the rest of us use is based on harm.

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#745
post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean “unfortunately”? What’s the hate for China I don’t understand

> What’s the hate for China I don’t understand country that does not allow internet is being hated on the internet

and yet they have the most internet users in the world...

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#747

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Copying over my comment from elsewhere in this post: Anthopic choosing to delay their models' invevitable distillation by competitors is their prerogative. That they choose to implement it by fingerprinting my access patterns without first disclosing is where they shit the bed. It isn't "sneaky" it's straight up sneaky (and dishonest and unscrupulous while we're at it). That this particular instance is harmless doesn…

Does their user agreement say they won't be harvesting PII?

Are you implying that Anthropic lawyers wrote the user agreement to protect users out of the goodness of their hearts? That's how they receive their big fat paychecks? Very funny.

We all know user agreements exist to strip users of their rights and to absolve companies of wrongdoing. We know that corporate apologists here are also well aware of this fact. When user agreements explicitly grant companies the right to screw over users, apologists are quick to make excuses about how it's all standard operating procedure and accuse people of being uncharitable for doing a plain reading of the text [1]. Yet when people are actually screwed over by companies, those very same people blame users for accepting the user agreement. It's a bad faith system.

User agreements are nothing more than power plays by exploitative companies.

[1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47953501

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#748
post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's good to agree that some don't have a conscience, and maintaining an appearance matters more. And appearances change based on what's legal or not. They could detect the other AI labs and also silently burn the tokens at a faster rate providing fewer tokens for money, which does sound illegal to me. The comments only further prove that without more regulation around this, big AI wouldn't have a "don't be evil" att…

Anyone who called for regulations/guardrails of any kind were shouted down as Luddites who hate progress. We all knew this was going to be a mess but $$$ so screw it right?

Maybe that's how OpenAI was able to blow $5.73 BILLION dollars on "marketing" i.e. paying politicians and influencers.

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#749

Value judgment aside: I am a bit surprised at how sloppily they did this. I think they could've achieved the same effect while decreasing the odds of detection via reverse engineering. (This field is known as "underhanded code", coined by the Underhanded C contest: https://www.underhanded-c.org . It's a little-known "art"; little-known for probably self-explanatory reasons. There are much cleverer ways of achieving o…

It's also possible that there are more in-depth detection methods and that this was just a cheap and easy first step that hasn't been removed because it catches a lot of less sophisticated bad actors. It's unlikely that this will stop a big AI lab from distilling their model if they're really determined, but A) it may be enough to stop a bunch of fly-by-night token resellers looking to make a quick buck and B) you ne…

But what's stopping someone from modifying or injecting code into the client to bypass this 'restriction'? This type of security should be implemented server-side and at the network perimeter not in the client, especially one written in TypeScript.

Re: Claude Code is steganographically marking requests

#750

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All of this is totally understandable if you take the perspective that these people genuinely believe they're building superintelligence. They aren't, they are building LLMs. They aren't even building AGI and they all know it. Hell, even if they came up with AGI, then Anthropic's service model would become slavery so I'm not sure why they'd want to.

> They aren't even building AGI and they all know it. That's a strong claim. Why do you believe they're lying about their beliefs? Have you ever interacted with the safety crowd or people that work at labs? They all seem to have high conviction in my experience.

> Why do you believe they're lying about their beliefs?

Because they lie about everything? They're adding more parameters to LLMs and pushing some more vibecoded slop on top of their harnesses, how do you figure that's gonna bring about AGI. Yeah Mythos has 5T parameters, but when we get to 7 5T it'll definitely become sentient bro just 2.5T more params bro you'll see.

Not to mention I still haven't heard a single explanation for why we could possibly want to give our IDEs consciousness.

Post reply on HN