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We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

waag.org

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Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#11

Post by jacobgold »

This is great. The entire idea of AT is that users can move their data for any reason. We want more of this.

But I do think it's always worth pushing back a bit on this idea:

> "The way Bluesky is funded is at odds with the idea of decentralisation because the platform relies on venture capital and operates under a shareholder model."

Large decentralized infrastructure like the internet, DNS, email, and the web was largely built by VC-backed companies.

The most important open source project, Linux, is funded by major tech companies through the Linux Foundation, with $311 million last year.

Corporate incentives do create conflicts, so it makes sense to be paranoid and skeptical. But the idea that companies can't contribute to open and decentralized systems is exactly the wrong lesson to learn.

We want more VC-backed startups working on open social networks and protocols. It would be great if many of them were in Europe.

Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#12

Post by dotcoma »

skybrian wrote: post #10
goody71 wrote: post #3

So the "news" here is they're hosting their own PDS? I think that was the main point of Atmosphere and Bluesky was just a popular gateway to get people into it. Unless I'm missing something else...

That's the plan, but to get to actual decentralization, one of the steps is for more people to actually move their PDS's somewhere other than Bluesky. (They are not self-hosting; Eurosky is doing it.)

But... if Waag are not self-hosting, and they're not, how likely is it that normal people will start doing so in relatively large numbers?

Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#13

Post by dotcoma »

jacobgold wrote: post #11

This is great. The entire idea of AT is that users can move their data for any reason. We want more of this. But I do think it's always worth pushing back a bit on this idea: > "The way Bluesky is funded is at odds with the idea of decentralisation because the platform relies on venture capital and operates under a shareholder model." Large decentralized infrastructure like the internet, DNS, email, and the web was l…

> the internet, DNS, email, and the web were largely built by VC-backed companies

Really ?

Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#15

Post by jacobgold »

dotcoma wrote: post #13
jacobgold wrote: post #11

This is great. The entire idea of AT is that users can move their data for any reason. We want more of this. But I do think it's always worth pushing back a bit on this idea: > "The way Bluesky is funded is at odds with the idea of decentralisation because the platform relies on venture capital and operates under a shareholder model." Large decentralized infrastructure like the internet, DNS, email, and the web was l…

> the internet, DNS, email, and the web were largely built by VC-backed companies Really ?

There were famously government and university programs that played important early roles too. But it was largely people working for companies that actually built these systems.

What organizations do you think created the switches, routers, servers, software, fiber optic backbones? Who created the new protocols?

It was companies like AT&T/Bell Labs, Cisco, 3Com, Sun, UUNET, Netscape, AOL, the major telecoms, and a thousand other companies we don't remember.

Something like 1% inspiration from academia and government, and 99% perspiration by people working inside companies.

Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#17

Post by skybrian »

jrm4 wrote: post #9

And what does this do safety/privacy-wise? Nothing, except make it more available. This is why I often argue against (or at least want to point out the dangers of) the ATProto/Bluesky model. It's an absolute boon for people who want heavy surveillance, government or otherwise. The looseness and "unreliability" of protocols like Mastodon ironically make them safer.

Yes, AT proto is about making data available to the public via replication. There's no privacy at all, but it's useful for some things. Hacker News comments don't have any privacy either.

There's another protocol in the works that should be useful for syncing private data:

https://github.com/bluesky-social/proposals/pull/94

Re: We moved our Bluesky data to Eurosky

#20

Post by skybrian »

dotcoma wrote: post #12
skybrian wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the plan, but to get to actual decentralization, one of the steps is for more people to actually move their PDS's somewhere other than Bluesky. (They are not self-hosting; Eurosky is doing it.)

But... if Waag are not self-hosting, and they're not, how likely is it that normal people will start doing so in relatively large numbers?

I don't think that's the goal? If we got to the point where no service hosts the majority of accounts, that would be a pretty good milestone.
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