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30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

theintercept.com

391–400 of 577 posts

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there actual evidence of "intent of mass murder"? It seems speculative at best.

Enough to convince a jury of their peers.

Maybe, but what was that evidence?

The U.S. administration seems to not require evidence for lots of statements and especially regarding ICE (c.f. statements made about Renee Good after she was murdered).

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#392
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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No the jan6 rioters just used poles and batons and such to beat the shit out of police- some who died afterward. https://youtu.be/DXnHIJkZZAs?si=zDKJcly9KMBY_GgJ I mean - seriously? It’s ok to do this?

>I mean - seriously? It’s ok to do this?

Where did I say it is? I said it's the same assault as ICE protestors and either both should be jailed or both should be pardoned, but pick one of these lane, because otherwise it's just selective enforcement.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#393
post #135
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was this a "demonstration" though? They turned up to a detention center in the middle of the night and launched an attack clearly with the intention of getting past the gate (text message exchanges show they had scoped out the operations of the gate, how long it takes to open/close, how long it remains open, etc). That's not really a "demonstration", no one outside of the facility would even see it. Demonstrations sh…

Per Wikipedia, at least at one point in time, it was supposed to be. Quote: Prosecutors produced group chat logs showing that the participants had debated at length whether they should bring guns. The former reservist allegedly wrote that "Cops are not trained or equipped for more than one rifle, so it tends to make them back off." Other chat participants argued that a noise demonstration was low risk and the assumpt…

Ok, but isn't this textbook second amendment?

as in well organised militia’s right to bear arms? They demonstrated a level of organisation much higher level than Rittenhouse ever did.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#394
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is like insisting a butter knife is a knife

People lose limbs all the time with fireworks

Yeah sure, if you hold the biggest firework you can legally buy in a closed fist something bad will happen, otherwise it's very unlikely... You're far more likely to cause damage by throwing rocks

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#395
post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Terrorist-related crime"? I mean, wouldn't the entire US air force be guilty of "terrorist-related crimes" for recently bombing a school full of children in Iran? Yet you don't see them being charged. Courts and the term "terrorist" are tools applied by the powerful to those without power in society.

I understand your frustration, you're trying to redefine the word "terrorist" on a website that deals with fact-based tech news.

I'm not trying to redefine the word for everyone, I'm speaking to you, I'm trying to get you to be more critical of your own personal usage of the word. When you adopt/parrot someone's claim about terrorism, that is not a neutral territory, and certainly isn't "fact-based". Especially if your other claims/deductions are downstream of the word "terrorism". It is almost always used as a propaganda term, commonly to justify horrific things, clearly it's been effective on you as well. There's a good book that spends a huge amount of time dissecting the use of the word terrorism you should check out: "Manufacturing Consent".

Besides I don't think you can neatly cleave the world, or this website, or the news, into "facts" and "emotions" as you seem to think.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#396
post #241

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Prisons are political violence. War is political violence. Policing is political violence. Pretty rich to hear moralizing about "poticial violence" from US citizens, the country which has the largest military, largest prison system, and spends the most on policing out of any country on the planet.

The state has a monopoly on all kinds of violence you listed. If it wouldn't you would either end up in civil war or a failed state with local warlords.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#397
https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/leader-antifa-cell-members-no...

One or two defendents were likely over prosecuted, the others it seems like a rather straight forward case. The issue is they were bombing/shooting at a federal facility which carries a higher sentence.

I find the sentences agregiously long, but that's a different discussion.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#398
post #5

It's pretty straightforward that if someone tells you to hide something because they've been arrested and they think it ties them to some criminal act, and then you hide it, you're an accessory to the crime. 30 years for that seems harsh though I anticipate they will be pardoned by the next Democratic Party President. Describing such an act without the obvious context is a pretty good way to point out that it's parti…

> 30 years for that seems harsh though I anticipate they will be pardoned by the next Democratic Party President.

I really doubt it.

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#399

Freedom of speech is absolute. It doesn't matter what the government thinks of the situation. It isn't a "crime" to move publications, even if the police think that. It's sickening how this could even possibly happen.

It is absolutely a crime to conceal evidence in an ongoing criminal trial. The contents of the publications is absolutely irrelevant: the individual was asked to conceal evidence and agreed to do it.

How does that boot taste?

Re: 30-year sentence for transporting zines is a five-alarm fire for free speech

#400
post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think that this was a protest then yeah it's worrying. The feds case, which they did win convictions based on, was that they were terrorists who set off fireworks to lure police into an ambush, and there weren't more casualties because one of the members shot early and only injured one cop. An accessory to this who hid evidence is also part of the crime in the Feds case Is this embellished by the Feds? I think…

"Lure police into an ambush" is quite a stretch. It's quite normal to do noise demonstrations outside jails/prisons to show solidarity with the captives, the captives will often times knock on the windows to communicate back. In fact there were noise demonstrations outside the Delaney Hall ICE jail in New Jersey just this month, which you may have heard about. The mischaracterization of fireworks as "explosives" is a…

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