Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech • Hacker News Board

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#101

Post by Nursie » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:51 AM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #78

bluegatty wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we have any number of social constructs around 'age and responsibility' - driving, alcohol, pubs, porn, excessive violence and so much more. It's bereft to suggest that we wouldn't nominally have those in the digital world. And, people are concerned about nth order effects, it's a huge point of debate. Yes - there is a huge slippery slope argument to be made, but it's an argument ... to be made. There are all sor…

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

Social media as it has become now is a shitshow where a minority of angry and/or disingenuous posters dominate discourse.

Twitter (X) was never the public square, and now it's little more than a playground for propagandists. The rest of us do well to ignore it, and it seems that even the 'legacy' media are starting to realise the days of breathlessly reporting on tweet-storms weren't great for anyone.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#102

Post by simondotau » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:52 AM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #78

bluegatty wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we have any number of social constructs around 'age and responsibility' - driving, alcohol, pubs, porn, excessive violence and so much more. It's bereft to suggest that we wouldn't nominally have those in the digital world. And, people are concerned about nth order effects, it's a huge point of debate. Yes - there is a huge slippery slope argument to be made, but it's an argument ... to be made. There are all sor…

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

A poor analogy.

The public square has never been properly anonymous. If you start saying things which contravene laws or the rights of others, the police have been able to capture you and unmask your identity, if concealed.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#103

Post by jimbob45 » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:53 AM UTC

What would you say to someone who is afraid that a bad actor will find their kids on Discord/Minecraft/4chan and encourage them to commit suicide or shoot up their school?

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#104

Post by yamillove » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:54 AM UTC

jrflowers wrote: post #93

yamillove wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That page says most kids can barely read. Are you a kid?

[dead]

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#105

Post by pavlov » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:55 AM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #78

bluegatty wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we have any number of social constructs around 'age and responsibility' - driving, alcohol, pubs, porn, excessive violence and so much more. It's bereft to suggest that we wouldn't nominally have those in the digital world. And, people are concerned about nth order effects, it's a huge point of debate. Yes - there is a huge slippery slope argument to be made, but it's an argument ... to be made. There are all sor…

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

Was there ever a public square where children could participate anonymously among adults? (I’m imagining three Dickensian urchins in a trench coat giving a speech in Hyde Park.)

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#106

Post by Nursie » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:56 AM UTC

vasco wrote: post #46

zarzavat wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems unlikely that running a website without age verification will be illegal across the entire planet.

It seemed unlikely to me that cookie banners would be a thing across the whole internet if nothing else because no website operators would put them in. How wrong was I. All they need to do is popularize the idea of "if your website doesn't do X, it'll place lower on google" and people will do anything. My websites still don't have cookie banners and the police still hasn't come to my house. And the websites uses cook…

You really only need the banners if you're doing privacy-impinging things.

Much like the GDPR notices that a small industry of 'compliance' product companies sold seemingly to everyone as necessary, they aren't if you're only using cookies for functional reasons and not tracking people. Unfortunately that leads to lower margins for advertisers and we can't have that.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#107

Post by hparadiz » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:56 AM UTC

Nursie wrote: post #101

dv_dt wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

Social media as it has become now is a shitshow where a minority of angry and/or disingenuous posters dominate discourse. Twitter (X) was never the public square, and now it's little more than a playground for propagandists. The rest of us do well to ignore it, and it seems that even the 'legacy' media are starting to realise the days of breathlessly reporting on tweet-storms weren't great for anyone.

In a recent survey of under sixteen year olds in a place where an under sixteen social media ban exists asked how many of them used social media found that 80% were still using it. Do you actually need a login to consume social media? The answer to that is no. You can doom scroll all you want on sites like Reddit with no account whatsoever.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#108

Post by kulahan » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:57 AM UTC

vasco wrote: post #66

kulahan wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

…upon device purchase? Very obviously?

The verification is not done per device but per usage session.

This is incorrect, and you have failed to read my mind on how it works. Extremely weird attempt, but I applaud the bravado anyways.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#109

Post by bluegatty » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:58 AM UTC

dv_dt wrote: post #78

bluegatty wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, we have any number of social constructs around 'age and responsibility' - driving, alcohol, pubs, porn, excessive violence and so much more. It's bereft to suggest that we wouldn't nominally have those in the digital world. And, people are concerned about nth order effects, it's a huge point of debate. Yes - there is a huge slippery slope argument to be made, but it's an argument ... to be made. There are all sor…

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

Your local library has age and ID requirements.

Your local 'town square' has 'some rules'.

Parents are entirely able to overcome any of this if they so choose - including feeding their kids alcohol, guns etc. - and so the freedom does materially exist.

Social Media isn't a place for free expression - it's mostly toxic - like exposing your children to the most vile, inauthentic people.

The more genteel places, frankly, won't have much in the way of age restrictions.

Entire nations are banning social media for kids because it's just not healthy - the teachers want it, the parents want it, the data seems to support it.

I think you're right to be (very concerned) but this is a necessary discussion. As a teacher.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#110

Post by hparadiz » Mon, Jun 29, 2026, 5:59 AM UTC

simondotau wrote: post #102

dv_dt wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

A poor analogy. The public square has never been properly anonymous. If you start saying things which contravene laws or the rights of others, the police have been able to capture you and unmask your identity, if concealed.

People publish entire books anonymously.