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Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

nonogra.ph

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Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#71

Post by microgpt »

NoPicklez wrote: post #53

I think you can look at all things pessimistically, like this article does but at the end of the day we all agree that there are things online we don't want our kids seeing or engaging with and it takes regulators to push how we protect them from those online places. What other options to regulators have? Age restriction has been around for longer than the internet itself, so its regulators applying that logic to the…

I like the California law where the device owner sets the parental controls and apps have to obey them or get fined.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#72

Post by microgpt »

stretchwithme wrote: post #44

Maybe it should be possible for a parent to set a child age in a device. Everyone else can stay anonymous. I look forward to hearing why that won't work and what problems it will cause.

You're describing California AB1043 which passed a few months ago and is now the law in California. We all got very angry about it when it passed.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#73

Post by microgpt »

vasco wrote: post #66
kulahan wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

…upon device purchase? Very obviously?

The verification is not done per device but per usage session.

Why are you telling someone else how their hypothetical implementation works?

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#74

Post by microgpt »

sixsupersoup wrote: post #8

Automated fines, like traffic radar control for free speech, will also become a norm as they won't be able to put everyone in jail. But I'm not sure the liberal anarcho-tyranny power will be indefinitely immutable. Speech control might be one their last try to keep control in the west. They will crumble like soviet union.

They have this in Germany for copyright. If you torrent, you automatically get a fine letter in your email. If you don't pay, you get a court summons in the post. If you take it to court, you will lose that case and also have to pay court fees.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#75

Post by shevy-java »

Fascism will lose in the long run. Right now the lobbyists coordinate rather effectively, looking at how many democracies already succumbed here. Well, we need direct democracy - the system that we have right now with regard to democracies, is undermined by corruption.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#76

Post by philipbjorge »

onion2k wrote: post #52
NoPicklez wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well we teach people the health benefits of physical activity school but many don't continue with it.

Sorry, this is going to be a rant. :) Admittedly it's a long time since I was in school, but when I was there the notion of teaching the benefits of physical activity was limited to being told to run about for some 'sport', and absolutely nothing about why that's a good idea. Everyone was expected to do the same thing with no consideration for ability, disability, or motivation. Kids were punished with detentions for…

It’s been 25 years since I was in school and this was my experience. Unsure if it’s changed…

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#77

Post by microgpt »

wuyuan wrote: post #7

You're right. Many countries use the protection of minors as an excuse, but in reality, they just want to strengthen the regulation of speech.

We should actually protect minors, then they won't be able to use it as an excuse. Right now it works as an excuse because minors are being harmed by the unrestricted internet, mostly by social media.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#78

Post by dv_dt »

bluegatty wrote: post #62
onion2k wrote: post #10

If we taught systems thinking in schools things like internet age verification would never get past being an idea on the back of a napkin. People struggle to consider the second-, third-, and nth-order effects of anything so asking them to consider what else might happen if we bring in laws and technical mechanisms to 'protect the children' is unfortunately too a big leap for a lot of them. Most people are bad at spo…

No, we have any number of social constructs around 'age and responsibility' - driving, alcohol, pubs, porn, excessive violence and so much more. It's bereft to suggest that we wouldn't nominally have those in the digital world. And, people are concerned about nth order effects, it's a huge point of debate. Yes - there is a huge slippery slope argument to be made, but it's an argument ... to be made. There are all sor…

Social media age verification is like none of those - social media is the modern public square and age verification is asking everybody to show their papers before participating in free speech in the public. It will have a chilling effect on free speech and will be a tool for authoritarian control

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#79

Post by shevy-java »

chii wrote: post #34
roenxi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fairness, the evidence is that people already pretty firmly against things like chat control and the will to push it through tends to come from the political circles more than popular belief it is a good idea. I expect that if the measure itself went to a general vote, the majority would be against it once they have to deal with a specific proposal. It takes repeated pushes by the authoritarians looking for an opp…

Stupid things like brexit was put to a vote, but really important things such as age verification and mass surveillance are never put to any vote.

But Brexit was a vote, by the people. Yes, the pro-leave campaign lied to no ends, but people still made a choice on their own and the majority for leave was quite slim.

This is very different to age sniffing here. Age sniffing is not being queried via public votum - lobbyists push it through without any resistance. It's amazing how this works.

Re: Age verification is just a precursor to automated attribution of speech

#80

Post by microgpt »

rockskon wrote: post #28
triceratops wrote: post #5

"Don't let them win. Don't verify your age. Don't give up your identity. If you absolutely must, find one of the numerous age verification services and pay in Monero." Better yet, how about - "call your representatives"? Some nerds, for lack of a better term, think crypto and cryptography are the answers to every privacy problem. The only way to fix society and the law is by engaging with those things. Not sidesteppi…

Law alone cannot fix it. Tech alone cannot fix it. If we wish to preserve the values we grew up with, we need both.

Law can fix 90% of it. Tech can fix 10%.
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