I don’t think people who write these headlines understand that “long live the king” used to refer to the next king. Where is the next tokenmaxxing?
Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
71–80 of 315 posts
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#72Tokenmaxxing was just a way to force employees to start leveraging AI in a meaningful way. For companies that have measured performance based on token spend, they can now dial it back. Employees have learned to leverage AI for things they wouldn’t have prior. Now they know what’s possible and what’s not. No one is stupid enough to always measure performance based on token spend and have unlimited budget. It was alway…
[dead]
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#73Beyond getting momentum going for a cmpany, Tokenmaxxing is lighting money on fire. The idea of tokenmaxxing reaches different companies in different waves, so it will be discovered in waves and outgrown in waves in companies and industries in their own cycle. In the long run, tokenmaxxing is like drunken sailor spending. Scaling is almost always about a large component of efficiency, and lighting money on fire in th…
Your comment implies no ROI on spent tokens. I get a lot more work done tokenmaxxing so the cost is negligible to me but YMMV. Of course there's no point in tokenmaxxing if you don't have enough work available to scale beyond yourself, or you're unable to use AI to do so.
I predict startups will continue to tokenmaxx while 40,000+ person companies will become a little more conservative.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#74Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why would a carpentry shop buy hundreds of thousands of dollars of power tools without consulting with their employees to see what they actually need to get their job done more effectively? The logic of buying the tools then forcing the employees to use them "or else" is completely backwards in any sane world. (Of course, we've all had bosses that went to some marketing seminar and come back having been tricked^Wsold…
Because those power tools had just been invented and no one had experience with them. Though in theory power tools are faster than hand tools.
So do a workshop on power tools, measure their efficacy and the quality of the result, do some demonstration videos on power tools, get people to compare, seek feedback on their usage. Don't count electricity and sawdust, or you'll find people getting very good at expensively turning blocks of wood into sawdust.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#75Earlier quoted context omitted.
The smart move would have been to get lower level managers to assign specific employees to experiment with applying LLMs to their processes and report back. Then incorpoate the findings into their processes. Instead there was FOMO mass hysteria. Now there is a backlash. And a lot of time and money wasted.
Letting everybody freely experiment for a while is much more effective than appointing somebody to do just that.
Freely experiment sure. But you're not doing an effective experiment if you tell people they'll be graded on how many tokens they use.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#76Tokenmaxxing was just a way to force employees to start leveraging AI in a meaningful way. For companies that have measured performance based on token spend, they can now dial it back. Employees have learned to leverage AI for things they wouldn’t have prior. Now they know what’s possible and what’s not. No one is stupid enough to always measure performance based on token spend and have unlimited budget. It was alway…
Its not _just_ that. Orgs aren't remotely sensible at measuring anything that isn't counted in dollars. employees who are on the ai bandwagon are there for the free management attention. Management is cooked because the damn market is hard, money is tight and they can't afford to fight the top down love and $$$ thrown at AI. If you zoom out, all the real money spent on energy to keep AI alive isn't going to be held i…
> Orgs aren't remotely sensible at measuring anything that isn't counted in dollars.
A sensible organization machinery will move to optimize the metrics that make money. Often times figuring out said machinery takes iterations. Some of them are idiotic (ref: tokenmaxxing) but they are generally directionally correct.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#77Folks have been saying “things are different now, the agents are now compounding success instead of error” for at least a year now, but I just don’t see it. I was lucky enough to receive a weeklong $50k per head AI training from the people saying these things, and one of their few helpful concrete recommendations was to constantly clear context all the time, to avoid things going off the rails.
However, I think finding security vulnerabilities is one use case where it doesn’t matter. Tokenmaxxing is absolutely effective for that. We as an industry are in the middle of adopting very expensive, complex continuous fuzzers.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#78Earlier quoted context omitted.
I really don't understand this take. If you're a carpentry shop that just bought power tools for the first time and you're worried that your employees are sticking with hand tools because that's what they know, then you look for sawdust. The goal isn't to have people work at converting wood into sawdust, the point is that if you wanna see if the tools are working you wanna see proof they're actually being used. I'm s…
Why would a carpentry shop buy hundreds of thousands of dollars of power tools without consulting with their employees to see what they actually need to get their job done more effectively? The logic of buying the tools then forcing the employees to use them "or else" is completely backwards in any sane world. (Of course, we've all had bosses that went to some marketing seminar and come back having been tricked^Wsold…
> If you want to see if the tools work, why don't you just ask your employees? Like any normal employer would?
because that would require actually admitting that employees are the people in an organisation who are responsible for the success of that organisation, rather than the people higher up the org chart.
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#79What is meant by a "loop" here? Just repeating the same prompt until you get the desired result? Are subsequent repetitions too close to each other?
Loop "engineering" has now become a thing now apparently (a la prompt "engineering")
https://github.com/topics/loop-engineering
Re: Tokenmaxxing is dead, long live tokenmaxxing
#80Tokenmaxxing was just a way to force employees to start leveraging AI in a meaningful way. For companies that have measured performance based on token spend, they can now dial it back. Employees have learned to leverage AI for things they wouldn’t have prior. Now they know what’s possible and what’s not. No one is stupid enough to always measure performance based on token spend and have unlimited budget. It was alway…
You’re post rationalizating
[deleted]