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What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

psychologytoday.com

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Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#81

Post by ceejayoz »

applfanboysbgon wrote: post #78
ceejayoz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> things you can fix on your own (diet + exercise) We have decades of research showing this is more in the "excess acid production" realm of things.

We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine, that it's easy to publish results that show the effect you're looking for, that there are rich, developed countries with obesity rates <5%, and that the obesity rate for Western countries spiked in recent years. This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking.

> We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine…

It seems unlikely to extend to bariatric surgery outcomes.

> This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking.

This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower seems like fanciful thinking.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#82

Post by Aaargh20318 »

saberience wrote: post #69
crooked-v wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not on GLP-1s, but I've been looking at very seriously because something I can't "fix on my own" is just... always feeling hungry. That's just how my body works. Exercise doesn't help; there's no reasonable amount of exercise that will help with my office-worker stomach wanting 3000 calories a day. So far through my life I've just lived with it and managed my diet as best I can and it just absolutely sucks.

[flagged]

The problem with exercise is that our bodies are quite efficient with their energy usage. A few minutes of ‘calories in’ takes many hours of ‘calories out’ to burn.

You can’t really exercise enough to offset the food you can eat in a day, even if you somehow were able to dedicate all your time to exercising you would still have to limit your food intake.

Add to that the fact that exercise is mind numbingly boring and you have to conclude it is not a practical solution at all.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#83

Post by crooked-v »

saberience wrote: post #69
crooked-v wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not on GLP-1s, but I've been looking at very seriously because something I can't "fix on my own" is just... always feeling hungry. That's just how my body works. Exercise doesn't help; there's no reasonable amount of exercise that will help with my office-worker stomach wanting 3000 calories a day. So far through my life I've just lived with it and managed my diet as best I can and it just absolutely sucks.

[flagged]

Exercise will burn calories, yes. But my life doesn't fit the several hours of exercise a day, every day, forever, that would be needed as an already-small person to burn the 1000+ excess calories a day my body is constantly hungry for.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#84

Post by applfanboysbgon »

ceejayoz wrote: post #81
applfanboysbgon wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine, that it's easy to publish results that show the effect you're looking for, that there are rich, developed countries with obesity rates <5%, and that the obesity rate for Western countries spiked in recent years. This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking.

> We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine… It seems unlikely to extend to bariatric surgery outcomes. > This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking. This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower seems like fanciful thinking.

Of course they aren't genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower. That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to. The issue is cultural, not genetic. You don't go from 12% obesity to 40% obesity in 40 years due to a genetic shift, but rather a cultural one.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#85

Post by randycupertino »

rubicon33 wrote: post #8
randycupertino wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm on GLP-1 and it's completely stopped my urge to online shop. I used to browse/shop for fun and out of habit or when I was stressed out or wanted a treat etc. Entirely resolved! I've also lost 40lbs on it.

Do you honestly believe in the so called “free lunch”? I mean there are MANY substances you can presently take that make you feel way better, but always come with a cost or a downside. Why should we believe GLP-1 class drugs are any different?

It definitely has downsides- it's $$, you have to take a shot every single week, I need to make sure to eat enough fiber now or I will not be regular. But that's a positive lifestyle change anyways- essentially am diligent now to ensure I get fiber every single day!

For me the pros outweigh the cons, I don't obsess over food constantly, my belt size went down and my watch band closed a few notches and even my dental hygienist mentioned last week my face was thinner. Overall it's a huge win.

I pay out of pocket $450 a month for it and it's worth it. The money I saw from no more online shopping habit and no more doordashing or drinking probably breaks even.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#86

Post by ceejayoz »

applfanboysbgon wrote: post #84
ceejayoz wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine… It seems unlikely to extend to bariatric surgery outcomes. > This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking. This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower seems like fanciful thinking.

Of course they aren't genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower. That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to. The issue is cultural, not genetic. You don't go from 12% obesity to 40% obesity in 40 years due to a genetic shift, but rather a cultural one.

> That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to.

This seems like one of those "replication crisis" claims.

> That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to.

So they're pre-ordained not to?

I have a loved one who certainly chooses to, to the point of having had bariatric surgery; GLPs have been an important follow-up. It's really not as simple as you make it out to be.

> You don't go from 12% obesity to 40% obesity in 40 years due to a genetic shift, but rather a cultural one.

What if that cultural one is letting the processed foods industry engineer everything to be deeply addicting?

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#87

Post by randycupertino »

sandcat_ wrote: post #7
randycupertino wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm on GLP-1 and it's completely stopped my urge to online shop. I used to browse/shop for fun and out of habit or when I was stressed out or wanted a treat etc. Entirely resolved! I've also lost 40lbs on it.

I'm curious, has it affected pleasure at all in other areas of life? Are things you used to enjoy still as enjoyable? Is it more the "addictiveness" of things that has dropped, as opposed to how enjoyable they are? (Never tried them myself, but very intrigued by them.)

I definitely used to use food as a source of joy, so I had try to and find things to replace that. I got really into getting my nails done, nail art and perfume/fragrances to help fill the joy gap. Also exercise and audiobooks.

I had to conscientiously try and find new "fun" things in my life to replace food, which used to be my treat/highlight of my life lol.

I notice a little less joy, pizza used to make me soooo happy lol. Now even if I have pizza- which I still totally can, I just accommodate for it, but it's just like... okay, whatever here's some pizza, cool. I can have 1 or 2 slices and feel fine and not go hog on the entire thing and have it be this amazing fantastic binge.

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#88

Post by krackers »

9x39 wrote: post #60
ceejayoz wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does there have to be a downside? What was the downside of washing hands before surgery?

Because our bodies are delicate systems of networks, and inputs in one area can have complex/unpredictable outputs elsewhere, it seems. Typically, if something "works", there often appear to be side effects. A free lunch is rare. https://www.uclahealth.org/news/article/understanding-medica...

The fact that GLP-1 seems to have roles not just in satiety but that agonists seem to reduce other types of impulsiveness (e.g. gambling, shopping) is interesting. That's not something you'd predict as a consequence, and perhaps is downstream of some gut-brain connection.

Of course we already manipulate brain chemistry in other more direct ways with antidepressants so perhaps any unwanted second-order effects could be minor in comparison to the profile of existing antidepressants .

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#89

Post by thereisnospork »

applfanboysbgon wrote: post #78
ceejayoz wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> things you can fix on your own (diet + exercise) We have decades of research showing this is more in the "excess acid production" realm of things.

We also know there's a replication crisis in psychology and medicine, that it's easy to publish results that show the effect you're looking for, that there are rich, developed countries with obesity rates <5%, and that the obesity rate for Western countries spiked in recent years. This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking.

>This idea that Americans are genetically pre-ordained to be fat seems like fanciful thinking.

The idea that it being genetic or not should matter is odd? Who cares why people are fat? They inarguably are fat and will by all available evidence be skinnier and healthier on a glp drug.

I fail to see the need for additional analysis or consideration?

Digging into the root cause or petitioning to tweak the food supply to reduce HFCS are admirable, but entirely orthogonal to the questions: "will taking ozempic et al make an overweight person's life better?" and "will making ozempic et al widely available improve America as a whole?"

Re: What Ozempic does to the gut-brain axis

#90

Post by applfanboysbgon »

ceejayoz wrote: post #86
applfanboysbgon wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they aren't genetically pre-ordained to lack willpower. That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to. The issue is cultural, not genetic. You don't go from 12% obesity to 40% obesity in 40 years due to a genetic shift, but rather a cultural one.

> That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to. This seems like one of those "replication crisis" claims. > That's why they could stop being fat, if only they chose to. So they're pre-ordained not to? I have a loved one who certainly chooses to, to the point of having had bariatric surgery; GLPs have been an important follow-up. It's really not as simple as you make it out to be. > You don't go from 12…

> So they're pre-ordained not to?

No. I'm saying it's within their power, so they aren't pre-ordained either way. You were suggesting that it's impossible for a large percentage of the population to not be obese without medical intervention, that it was comparable to excessive acid production which is a genetic anomaly and out of an individual's own control.

> What if that cultural one is letting the processed foods industry engineer everything to be deeply addicting?

Sure, the industry bears some blame and is part of the cultural issue, but even if presented with addicting substances, it is both an individual choice to consume them and a collective cultural choice not to regulate them.

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