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OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

openttd.org

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Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#31

Post by JamesTRexx »

orthoxerox wrote: post #16

Separating locomotives from trains next? And then, finally, hump yards?

> Separating locomotives from trains next? Someone wrote a patch for version 8 or 9 years ago which enabled coupling and decoupling, although one needed to set it up in a specific order to avoid failing couplings or train crashes. It's a shame the devs never picked it up.

> And then, finally, hump yards? I doubt a hump yard will ever be a feature because as far as I see it, it would need a complete overhaul of the way orders are set up and handled. Right now it's one semi-static order list for the whole train and a sorting yard needs dynamic order lists per locomotive and each wagon.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#32

Post by somat »

rplnt wrote: post #4

I always know what kind of game I want to play, but it's overwhelming to set up, if even possible. It's tons of packages, forums, idk.. so I just end up playing vanilla, with maybe some rules among the players. But I wish there was a comprehensive interface to allow me to set all the stuff that I want. From the top of my head (haven't played in over a year) it would be: cargo destination for people, cargo prices refl…

Simutrans?

Half joking because if you are really into TTD The Simutrans interface feels terible(It looks like TTD but does not feel like TTD, this is often why photoshop people hate the gimp so much) but...

I started with simutrans, and have a hard time with ttd. Their systems disgust me in a way that they probably should not but it is that same bugbear, it looks like simutrans but does not feel like simutrans.

If anyone does try it out, beware pak128. The paks are more like mods that change the goods and price ratios rather than the mere graphics updates that their name would suggest. As someone who plays the hell out of pak64 I can't make a functioning network in pak128. I almost suspect it is broken. The price ratios just never work out. pak192comic however, is easy, fun and looks good.

https://www.simutrans.com it is also free on steam, probably the easiest way to play.

If I had to describe the difference, it is that simutrans tries a little harder with it's systems, it take a little more care to make a functioning network in simutrans. Factories have specific destinations and storage sizes. for example iron ore to steel mill will jam full if you fail to deliver the steel to the car factory and no steel will be made if you fail to deliver the coal it needs. So freight network revenue is fragile until the entire chain is complete. Passenger service is tricky because the passengers want to go somewhere(exactwhere is not specified, you have to treat it statistically). If your network does not go there they won't take your trains. So the ideal is to have service everywhere, but you you have to start small and small pax networks make no money, thus why it is tricky. The money is made on the fast long distance routes, and you take a loss on the slow urban routes just to make sure you have their destination/origin covered.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#33

Post by NoboruWataya »

phtrivier wrote: post #18

Sorry if it's a meta post, or a faq, or if I'm just missing some HN lore here, but I finally have to ask : why is it that, everytime there's a new release for OpenTTD (and 0ad, for that matters), it makes it to the front page ? I can kinda get why there are often news about Factorio, for example (it's not subtly related to programming), and there is nothing wrong with open source projects getting visibily even when t…

I think it's just that it's a cool game that's popular with HNers. Same with 0ad and other software like GnuCash. Always interesting to see what new features they have introduced and even just read how others play the game.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#34

Post by netsharc »

JamesTRexx wrote: post #29

I made version 12.2 my programming hobby project. First time I tackled it years ago was to have it run at real time instead of the default fast pace (even with the day length patch). Worked great including a feature to really schedule routes and have working yards for vehicles to wait. But when I wanted to change internal mechanics to add other features I hit the spaghetti code wall several times (and the code after…

How fast do the trains and buses run on "real time" speed?

I suppose a 15 meter bus going 50km/h travels roughly its own length (13.40 meters to be exact) every second, so it takes 3 seconds to pass a grid square - checking out a YouTube video, it seems that's already the speed right now!

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#35

Post by gilrain »

tyteen4a03 wrote: post #24
rplnt wrote: post #4

I always know what kind of game I want to play, but it's overwhelming to set up, if even possible. It's tons of packages, forums, idk.. so I just end up playing vanilla, with maybe some rules among the players. But I wish there was a comprehensive interface to allow me to set all the stuff that I want. From the top of my head (haven't played in over a year) it would be: cargo destination for people, cargo prices refl…

If you're happy with not doing cargo and can tolerate an also slightly weird pax distribution, I highly recommend [NIMBY Rails]( https://store.steampowered.com/app/1134710/NIMBY_Rails/ ).

Thanks for recommending this! It’s looks exactly to my taste, but I hadn’t heard of it.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#36

Post by jemmyw »

TylerE wrote: post #23
jemmyw wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For most signalling you want the path signals. They come in 2 flavours: both kinds only do the path in one direction, one kind is non-blocking to trains running the opposite way, the other kind is blocking, one way only. This combo lets you set up an upline and downline with a terminal station: you have one way only signals on the line, and non-blocking signals on the station entrances pointing into the station, and…

>This combo lets you set up an upline and downline with a terminal station: That actually is nothing to do with path based signals, and could be done quite simply with purely vanilla TTD signals. What path-based signaling allows is for multiple trains to make non-conflicting moves through a single block at the same time, which basic signals wouldn't.

That's not quite true. The original signals would let a train into the cross over block when no station lines were available because they didn't have that pass through. Depending on the layout it would either get stuck or end up heading in the wrong direction. Pre-signals could solve it but they weren't in the original.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#37

Post by TylerE »

jemmyw wrote: post #36
TylerE wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This combo lets you set up an upline and downline with a terminal station: That actually is nothing to do with path based signals, and could be done quite simply with purely vanilla TTD signals. What path-based signaling allows is for multiple trains to make non-conflicting moves through a single block at the same time, which basic signals wouldn't.

That's not quite true. The original signals would let a train into the cross over block when no station lines were available because they didn't have that pass through. Depending on the layout it would either get stuck or end up heading in the wrong direction. Pre-signals could solve it but they weren't in the original.

You just put a signal at both ends of the passing loop. Just the way they’re signaled in real life - one signal to authorize a train into the loop, one to authorize movements out of the loop.

Path based signals (nor pre-signals for that matter) didn’t exist in plain original TTD and constructing such track layouts was easy and straightforward.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#38

Post by JamesTRexx »

netsharc wrote: post #34
JamesTRexx wrote: post #29

I made version 12.2 my programming hobby project. First time I tackled it years ago was to have it run at real time instead of the default fast pace (even with the day length patch). Worked great including a feature to really schedule routes and have working yards for vehicles to wait. But when I wanted to change internal mechanics to add other features I hit the spaghetti code wall several times (and the code after…

How fast do the trains and buses run on "real time" speed? I suppose a 15 meter bus going 50km/h travels roughly its own length (13.40 meters to be exact) every second, so it takes 3 seconds to pass a grid square - checking out a YouTube video, it seems that's already the speed right now!

I calculated it long ago but I can't find the original notes. It can be extrapolated from the default 74 ticks a day (and the distance represented by 1 tile) to ((33 ticks per cpu second) * 86400) in my patch, and I think it came about a tile size of around 8 metres or so. Too long ago to be sure, but I found a time speedup of 4x compared to realtime was a good compromise. It made transport by slow vehicles viable to keep factories running, or a lot less were needed to keep up deliveries. The newer setting for minutes per tick made realtime possible eventually. I had it set to 11, I think.

It was also quite easy to limit production (or passengers) in the code from 06:00 to 20:00 a day for a little extra realism with either emptying a station during the night or have no traffic servicing buildings. Even weekends are possible. Warehouses would be a nice addition.

Re: OpenTTD 16.0-Beta1

#39

Post by massysett »

phtrivier wrote: post #18

Sorry if it's a meta post, or a faq, or if I'm just missing some HN lore here, but I finally have to ask : why is it that, everytime there's a new release for OpenTTD (and 0ad, for that matters), it makes it to the front page ? I can kinda get why there are often news about Factorio, for example (it's not subtly related to programming), and there is nothing wrong with open source projects getting visibily even when t…

OpenTTD and 0ad are open-source games that have been under development for many years, which tickles the hacker sensibility. I think these two games fit into the HN mindset much more than Factorio, which is a newer, proprietary game.
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