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Doing a masters while working in Spain

jan-herlyn.com

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Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#51

Post by david-gpu »

retired wrote: post #44
SiempreViernes wrote: post #40

> Culture-wise, the professors at the university were also very different than what I was used to in Germany. [...] My thesis advisor, Alicia Ageno, for instance, had a meeting with me about every two weeks and sent me relevant papers and advice on a subject that was not her current research topic anymore. This makes german supervision sound pretty abysmal! Maybe that's why the thesis project I had with a German prof…

Doing my thesis in The Netherlands I got guidance on my thesis three times. Once during the start to get an initial baseline of what is expected of me, once halfway through as a quick call to see if everything was going according to schedule and once when I had the concept ready. If you need someone to hold your hand every other week perhaps you shouldn’t go into academics. You should be operating autonomous at that…

A Master's thesis is not for somebody aiming for academia. It is a requirement for graduation. Rather different from a PhD.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#52

Post by aleph_minus_one »

progbits wrote: post #49
retired wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doing my thesis in The Netherlands I got guidance on my thesis three times. Once during the start to get an initial baseline of what is expected of me, once halfway through as a quick call to see if everything was going according to schedule and once when I had the concept ready. If you need someone to hold your hand every other week perhaps you shouldn’t go into academics. You should be operating autonomous at that…

This comment is little abrasive but there is truth to it. I've seen many people who are quite competent under close supervision but completely clueless on their own. We could debate if academia would be better off with different approach though.

> I've seen many people who are quite competent under close supervision but completely clueless on their own.

Being able to work on complicated research topics on your own is what universities are centrally preparing for.

If you really need close supervision, you likely are not made for academia or often not even for a course of studies at a university.

Yes, this is a harsh truth, but academia is really a brutal game of sink or swim.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#53

Post by david-gpu »

aleph_minus_one wrote: post #52
progbits wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is little abrasive but there is truth to it. I've seen many people who are quite competent under close supervision but completely clueless on their own. We could debate if academia would be better off with different approach though.

> I've seen many people who are quite competent under close supervision but completely clueless on their own. Being able to work on complicated research topics on your own is what universities are centrally preparing for. If you really need close supervision, you likely are not made for academia or often not even for a course of studies at a university. Yes, this is a harsh truth, but academia is really a brutal game…

A Master's degree is hardly academia, is it? A PhD is the starting point for a career in research, and even that does not necessarily imply academia, either.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#54

Post by SiempreViernes »

mishellaneous wrote: post #37
SiempreViernes wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but how do you deal with the fact that university, in practice, is not "for the joy of learning"? I think this strongly depends on the subject you study, most people in mechanical engineering will have a very different attitude to people studying world literature or astrophysics.

good to know, thanks. it does make sense. there's still the professors though. the courses may not necessarily be different from their point of view. also, what do you make of physics grads going to work on finance? doesn't strike as very "scholarly" of them, at first.

Here's an article where a physics grad himself is calling being a quant as "the dark side", it's from last year but the expression is much older.

https://www.colorado.edu/physics/2025/09/22/quantum-physics-...

At the end of the day part of what makes (theoretical) physics "scholarly" is the poor job prospects outside of academia, but there simply aren't enough positions for everyone graduating with a masters and they have to find some job eventually. Being a quant certainly beats becoming weapon designers.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#55

Post by aleph_minus_one »

david-gpu wrote: post #53
aleph_minus_one wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've seen many people who are quite competent under close supervision but completely clueless on their own. Being able to work on complicated research topics on your own is what universities are centrally preparing for. If you really need close supervision, you likely are not made for academia or often not even for a course of studies at a university. Yes, this is a harsh truth, but academia is really a brutal game…

A Master's degree is hardly academia, is it? A PhD is the starting point for a career in research, and even that does not necessarily imply academia, either.

> A Master's degree is hardly academia, is it?

In Germany, the master degree is considered as such. Basically the final test before you decide for or against "the whole brutal game of joining a doctoral study program".

A professor that I know clearly said: "In a master's thesis I expect something scientifically novel. It does not have to be something deep, but if you want 'a 1 before the comma' (in Germany, the grading at a uninversity goes from 1,0 to 5,0 where 5,0 means 'failed'), it has to be something scientifically novel. The number after the mark is to distinguish whether it is really a deep discovery or not."

Be also culturally aware that in practice, for a final thesis

- 1.0 means "good",

- 1.3 means "average",

- 1.7 means "bad",

- everything below (from 2.0 on) basically means "failure" (you get a degree, but are marked as failure).

So, the professor clearly stated that every grade for a master thesis that "is not in practice a failure grade" means "some novel scientific discovery". And every grade that is better than "in practice 'bad'" means "some very non-trivial scientific discovery".

I know that many professors think this way, though most of them would phrase this more diplomatically.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#56

Post by jmspring »

gib444 wrote: post #10
jmspring wrote: post #3

We will be hopping over to Italy/France/or Croatia in the next year or so. Work will not be the motivator, but we both have options. In the states during late covid, I thought the downtime would be good to do a second masters in something unrelated to working in software. I chose a remote program with a univeristy here in the states, I did the first year, but it reminded me that studying - especially a program unrela…

> Work will not be the motivator, but we both have options. Which work visa did you apply for? Or do you have an EU passport?

EU passport through my wife's family.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#57

Post by FabHK »

oersted wrote: post #21
cjd8 wrote: post #14

Great job! A few months ago I was kicked out of university for failing my Real Analysis course a second time (4 years of CS suddenly gone, thesis was half done) and had to get a full time job. Now I got accepted to a different public university to study on a weekend basis. This article makes me less anxious about my upcoming studies.

That sounds incredibly harsh. What kind of university was it? Is there more to the story? Kicking someone out and effectively voiding all progress just for failing one challenging final year class twice is completely mad. Was it rather that you lost a scholarship and couldn’t afford to finish or something like that? Sorry to dwell, I’m sure it must be painful, I wish you the best luck.

Sorry, that strikes me as the norm. Graduation is predicated on passing certain courses, and obviously you can't take it an arbitrary number of times. So fail an exam twice, and you're out. (Some universities offer a final oral exam after failing a written exam twice.)

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#58

Post by retired »

david-gpu wrote: post #51
retired wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doing my thesis in The Netherlands I got guidance on my thesis three times. Once during the start to get an initial baseline of what is expected of me, once halfway through as a quick call to see if everything was going according to schedule and once when I had the concept ready. If you need someone to hold your hand every other week perhaps you shouldn’t go into academics. You should be operating autonomous at that…

A Master's thesis is not for somebody aiming for academia. It is a requirement for graduation. Rather different from a PhD.

In The Netherlands all Masters at a university are to prepare you for an academic career.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#59

Post by pvaldes »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #40

> Culture-wise, the professors at the university were also very different than what I was used to in Germany. [...] My thesis advisor, Alicia Ageno, for instance, had a meeting with me about every two weeks and sent me relevant papers and advice on a subject that was not her current research topic anymore. This makes german supervision sound pretty abysmal! Maybe that's why the thesis project I had with a German prof…

Your mileage may vary.

Re: Doing a masters while working in Spain

#60

Post by ecshafer »

SiempreViernes wrote: post #40

> Culture-wise, the professors at the university were also very different than what I was used to in Germany. [...] My thesis advisor, Alicia Ageno, for instance, had a meeting with me about every two weeks and sent me relevant papers and advice on a subject that was not her current research topic anymore. This makes german supervision sound pretty abysmal! Maybe that's why the thesis project I had with a German prof…

I have never heard of a professor at any level helping a student debug code past maybe CS1.
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