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Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

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Re: Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

#271

Post by Alpha3031 »

slg wrote: post #140
logicchains wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>assets capture by tiny percent of the population Those asserts were _created_ by a tiny percent of the population; if they hadn't been allowed to create those assets then they wouldn't exist. Europe is an example of that: it has only 2 companies in the Fortune 500 (500 biggest companies) that were created in the past 20 years, i.e. essentially no tech industry there. Because the policies there make entrepreneurship…

And is life in Europe actually worse than the US as a result? Capitalism has convinced people to think that the end goal of life is creating value. Maybe that isn't the thing society should be optimizing for.

Income-wise difference is significantly less when adjusted for PPP, and (this is from a decade ago but I can't find anything much more recent that goes into comparing countries) Jones and Klenow (2016) says:

> Average Western European living standards appear much closer to those in the United States (around 85 percent for welfare versus 67 percent for income) when we take into account Europe’s longer life expectancy, addi- tional leisure time, and lower inequality.

Jones, Charles I.; Klenow, Peter J. (September 2016). "Beyond GDP? Welfare across Countries and Time". American Economic Review. *106* (9): 2426–2457. https://doi.org/10.1257/aer.20110236. ISSN 0002-8282. S2CID 1352951.

Re: Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

#273

Post by rootusrootus »

mrandish wrote: post #255
rootusrootus wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The 1D thing is an obvious over-simplification In general I agree, but in recent history it works pretty well if the dimension you use is Trump rather than left/right (assuming you are in the US). He is the most polarizing leader I have seen in the US in my lifetime, and knowing whether someone is a supporter is pretty good at predicting the rest of their viewpoints.

> knowing whether someone is a {Trump} supporter is pretty good at predicting the rest of their viewpoints. If instead of "is a supporter" you'd said "agrees with Trump's positions", then even Trump himself might not correlate very well :-). I don't see Trump as a very useful proxy for nuanced political viewpoints since he's a populist who tends to change positions. I think many serious conservatives only align with…

Speaking from my own experience, all of my friends who are currently identifying as Trump Supporters (this is a pretty tight filter now, we're getting down into Keyes Constant territory) are reliably "whatever Trump is currently for." Their positions change in lockstep with whatever Trump is currently saying, even as it toggles back and forth day by day, week by week. Their ideology isn't political, it is personal.

My wider circle of conservative friends who have traditional ideologically conservative positions are mostly not Trump Supporters any more. For most of them starting a war in Iran seems to have been what finally tipped them over the edge.

Re: Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

#276

Post by DangitBobby »

gherkinnn wrote: post #237
patrickmay wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the Nolan Chart ( https://www.theadvocates.org/political-type-comparison/ ) to be a better version of the 2D compass. You're absolutely right that more dimensions would be better, but finding the right orthogonal ones is difficult. The Nolan Chart is superior to the simplistic left vs right of U.S. political discourse in part because it shows there is more variation than the major parties would like everyone t…

It says that I am very progressive, and yet I find that wing's usual baggage laughable. Monty Python knew it all along, the Judaea's Peoples Front are the worst, it's every man's right to have babies and anyway, what have the Romans ever done for us?

That doesn't make you not progressive FWIW

Re: Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

#279

Post by endominus »

nonethewiser wrote: post #261
endominus wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"The government has the right to force people to take vaccines against their will for the sake of public safety." - Authoritarian Left "The government has no right to legislate that a woman cannot have an abortion - women should control their own bodies." - Libertarian Left "The government has the right and responsibility to shut down sources of misinformation in the news and online." - Authoritarian Right "Capitalis…

> "The government has no right to legislate that a woman cannot have an abortion - women should control their own bodies." - Libertarian Left This classification depends on the aborted NOT being a person. If it’s a person then the libertarian position would be anti abortion because an abortion would maximally harm the individual liberty of that person. I think a clearer example of lib/left is gay marriage or drug leg…

Just as people pointed out that my misinformation line was also said by AuthLeft, gay marriage and drug legalization are both supported by LibRight (under the reasoning of government minimization). But that just speaks to the problem; the political compass tries to map stances to political groups that often believe things arbitrarily, rather than grounding their positions on peoples' perspectives and framework for understanding the world. That's why I like the other political compass I linked in the sibling thread; it's based more on a person's understanding of the world rather than tribal allegiance.

Re: Political bias in AI: Where the AI models stand

#280

Post by xigoi »

rootusrootus wrote: post #174
bee_rider wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The space (if it really is useful to think of as a space) of political opinions seems like it is probably many, many dimensional. The 1D thing is an obvious over-simplification, but the 2D compass seems to be a not-obvious-simplification which is… much worse.

> The 1D thing is an obvious over-simplification In general I agree, but in recent history it works pretty well if the dimension you use is Trump rather than left/right (assuming you are in the US). He is the most polarizing leader I have seen in the US in my lifetime, and knowing whether someone is a supporter is pretty good at predicting the rest of their viewpoints.

I don’t agree with Trump on most things, but my beliefs also definitely don’t agree with most people who hate Trump.
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