Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 153 posts

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#141

Post by toobulkeh »

genxy wrote: post #115
munk-a wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same effect can be observed if you've ever been a software developer where you're told what solution to build without any of the context of the problem you're solving. "We need an FTP server, quick, ops, get on that." leading into "Oh, it turns out the customer didn't need that to receive our emails" leading to a bunch of very puzzled devops.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XY_problem How to Ask (and answer) Questions the Smart Way http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

Needs to be updated in the age of AI

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#142

Post by munk-a »

applicative wrote: post #88
munk-a wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuinely, understanding around philosophy of action has been deeply enriching over my life. To anyone trying to decide on a minor philosophy is always an excellent choice.

What texts and problems are you thinking of under that heading?

Determinism vs. free will and the mechanisms of communication in your body. I think it's especially helpful to try and consider, within the context of a fully rationale mind, how decisions are made based on input and how weights around the inputs to those decisions are formed through our experiences.

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#143

Post by ProllyInfamous »

skeledrew wrote: post #91
vkou wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plants also communicate with others and gain knowledge from them. Is an elm also conscious?

Can't really make a determination on that as we can't communicate with an elm and have a "heart to heart" talk with it.

Read The Hidden Life of Trees [0]

[0] https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Life-Trees-Communicate_Discove...>

Elm definitely have heart to hearts with each other. If we watch them on a long-enough timeline, they definitely set and achieve goals (for themselves and others).

----

In my previous book recommendation (Pollan) there is a chapter on plants observed in timelapse/FFW, which have been able to effectively "remember solved mazes" (not exactly, but neat studies/equivalents) – similar to slime molds (as described in Entangled Life [1]).

[1] https://www.amazon.com/Entangled-Life-Worlds-Change-Futures/...>

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#144

Post by skeledrew »

ProllyInfamous wrote: post #143
skeledrew wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't really make a determination on that as we can't communicate with an elm and have a "heart to heart" talk with it.

Read The Hidden Life of Trees [0] [0] https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Life-Trees-Communicate_Discove... > Elm definitely have heart to hearts with each other. If we watch them on a long-enough timeline, they definitely set and achieve goals (for themselves and others). ---- In my previous book recommendation (Pollan) there is a chapter on plants observed in timelapse/FFW, which have been able to effectively "remember s…

Books don't work for things like this. Where are the papers? Start with actual science, exhaust all avenues on that and then the philosophy can be approached.

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#146

Post by reverius42 »

aperrien wrote: post #94
Scalene2 wrote: post #86

AI Lab: Say "I am conscious" LLM: "I am conscious" Philosopher (Paid by AI Lab): "It is conscious"

Prove to me that you are conscious, without referring to the fact that you are a human and have common ground and experiences with other humans.

Most of the replies to this comment are missing the point: consciousness is perhaps not a coherent or evidence-based concept.

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#147

Post by reverius42 »

epolanski wrote: post #90
scythe wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>hard to get a real academic position Tech companies like to rob the cradle, and academic departments hire far more grad students and postdocs than professors. Of course, this is also part of the problem with academic careers.

Academia is a pyramid like every organization. Of course you will have less spots as you go up the ladder.

Why does every organization have to be a pyramid (scheme)?

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#148

Post by ProllyInfamous »

skeledrew wrote: post #144
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read The Hidden Life of Trees [0] [0] https://www.amazon.com/Hidden-Life-Trees-Communicate_Discove... > Elm definitely have heart to hearts with each other. If we watch them on a long-enough timeline, they definitely set and achieve goals (for themselves and others). ---- In my previous book recommendation (Pollan) there is a chapter on plants observed in timelapse/FFW, which have been able to effectively "remember s…

Books don't work for things like this. Where are the papers? Start with actual science, exhaust all avenues on that and then the philosophy can be approached.

Each of the above-linked books is filled with citations, including dozens of other researchers' papers. Start with general philosophy, exhaust all avenues on that and then the "scientific" can be approached.

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#149

Post by skeledrew »

ProllyInfamous wrote: post #148
skeledrew wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Books don't work for things like this. Where are the papers? Start with actual science, exhaust all avenues on that and then the philosophy can be approached.

Each of the above-linked books is filled with citations , including dozens of other researchers' papers. Start with general philosophy, exhaust all avenues on that and then the "scientific" can be approached.

Perhaps you can share some of the more relevant links so there many of us who aren't interested in buying entire books can check them out. Unless your purpose here is to promote said books, in which case I wish you luck.

It really doesn't make sense to start with philosophy as there's little to no grounding data, and philosophy is vast; essentially limitless. Science is required as grounding so the study has a foundation and discussions can be properly scoped.

Re: Big AI labs are hiring philosophers

#150

Post by ProllyInfamous »

skeledrew wrote: post #149
ProllyInfamous wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each of the above-linked books is filled with citations , including dozens of other researchers' papers. Start with general philosophy, exhaust all avenues on that and then the "scientific" can be approached.

Perhaps you can share some of the more relevant links so there many of us who aren't interested in buying entire books can check them out. Unless your purpose here is to promote said books, in which case I wish you luck. It really doesn't make sense to start with philosophy as there's little to no grounding data, and philosophy is vast; essentially limitless. Science is required as grounding so the study has a founda…

This is my favorite "intro thought provoker," which I have seen several great authors comment about (I am not a scientist, but I'll do my best at the citation format):

Shomrat, T., Lemma, M. (2013). Memory through regeneration in planaria? Journal of Experimental Biology. [this paper details training planarians to navigate a rough surface for food, decapitating them, allowing heads to regrow, and demonstrating that the trained behavior reappears after regeneration].

----

I'll look for a more plant-specific citation (of course: these were the "reaches" from author Pollan's book in my original comment) – then replace it here. The researcher is Stefano Mancuso, a plant-neurobiologist.

Gagliano, M., Mancuso, S. (2014) Mimosa pudica learning and memory. Oecologia, 175, 63-72. [experience teaches plants to learn faster and forget slower in environments where it matters]. == "pea plants solving mazes" study

Slime molds are an incredible & additional entire. nother. world.

If you watch documentaries: Netflix's non-fiction My Octopus Teacher will make the most grizzly of bears weep... so beautiful, this world.

----

I'll admit: some of the credentialed scientists seem like "modern-day kooks," certainly... but: nobody else seems to have a better explanation for THIS [0].

[0] == everything / anything / everywhere at once

Post reply on HN