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Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

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Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#61

Post by nilirl »

As someone who only gets time to read when tired at the end of the day: I can't get past the first 50 pages of any Dostoyevsky work.

Why are the classics classic? I doubt being a great read is sufficient or necessary; I struggle to read most classics, Dickens being the only exception.

I'm not reading to study, I want to be entertained! I want engagement, I want clarity, I want suspense! I don't want to wrestle with the author's intentions, I want to be gripped by the character and their situation.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#62

Post by shermantanktop »

I (precocious, pretentious me) read Anna Karenina in 7th grade. It was long but not difficult. Keeping track of the characters was the hardest part.

I’d like to say the story stayed with me, but alas it was the reaction of adults to my reading matter that I remember.

Part of growing up was realizing that being precocious really isn’t a thing anymore at some point.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#63

Post by SugarReflex »

I was blown away by Crime and Punishment. I truly felt like I was the main character, and I read it with feverish sweat and dread for my impending doom. I cringed and felt terrible sadness at the poor little lives of certain individuals. So much woe and tragedy. I was glad to see how it turned out though.

I'm currently reading Karamazov and it's good to have something a bit more jovial and dry witted.

The main difficulty is the names. The names make it so hard.

I love the Space Trilogy by Lewis but I lose my place when he describes a place. Dostoevsky is better at describing people (and bringing them to life in your mind) than Lewis is at describing a landscape.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#64

Post by postalcoder »

I became motivated to read Russian literature after Norm Macdonald died, knowing how much influence it had on him and chasing more of his voice. Reading Brothers Karamazov in Norm's voice made it so much more entertaining. Ironically, Norm viewed Dostoyevsky as one of the inferior Russian writers.

Here's some of Norm's thoughts about Russian literature and how to read it:

    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Tolstoy is the best writer who has ever lived. Some people are intimidated
    by that fact.

    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Read, in chronological order if possible, everything Tolstoy has ever
    written.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    People think Tolstoy would be too difficult to understand since he is the
    greatest writer to ever have drawn breath.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Since I am asked about Tolstoy I will suggest all read him. Read all he has
    written. Here's the thing about Tolstoy.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Tolstoy could write a massive book like War & Peace and have every word be
    necessary.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Dosto is a fine writer. Better are Tolstoy, Chekhov, Gogol, Turgenev and
    Pushkin.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    To be a great writer you must be able to communicate with the reader.
    Tolstoy communicates better than anyone else ever.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Dostoevsky was far the inferior to Tolstoy, he was inferior to most of the
    great Russians.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 9, 2016
    Agree completely. Should read both actually. and P&V have not translated
    most Tolstoy, so then go to Constance.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Feb 7, 2018
    Well, Jocelyn, I don't know of what other authors you refer to, but Tolstoy
    isn't a nihilist. X.com/FLEURdian_slip...
    
    T.L. States  @epmornsesh · Dec 21, 2018
    @normmacdonald Any authors you would recommend that are writing killer
    comedic fiction?
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Dec 21, 2018
    Tolstoy, Chekhov, Philip Roth, Salinger, me.
    
    Norm Macdonald  @normmacdonald · Jan 21, 2019
    @GaryGulman Read great works of Literature out loud. If you do not
    understand what you are reading, stop, figure out what it means, then
    repeat the exercise. Do this an hour a day and in time, your own voice,
    your own thoughts will become the same as Tolstoy, Faulkner, Twain.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#65

Post by gtg239a »

blast wrote: post #45
CalChris wrote: post #39

I liked The Possessed by Elif Batuman. I had read The Idiot in high school, a death march for a term paper. But I liked Batuman's reading of it better than mine (but not enough to re-read it). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elif_Batuman

> The Possessed (2010), The Idiot (2017), and Either/Or (2022) That's like publishing Hamlet (2010), King Lear (2017), and Thus Spake Zarathustra (2022). I wonder what her thought process is in choosing these titles? And what will her next work be?

She has an academic background in Russian Literature and writes really engaging essays about her encounters with the literature (The Possessed). I can’t recommend her novels and essays enough. They’re riotously funny and erudite and readable if you’re looking for something.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#67

Post by gtg239a »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #5
david927 wrote: post #2

I also stumbled onto Crime and Punishment at 18 and expected it to be difficult and was blown away with how Dostoyevsky wrote one of the greatest novels of all time, to be sure, but as the author here says, also how engaging he made it. The scene where he commits the crime is an absolute stunner, edge-of-your-seat, thriller. Who does that? Who can pull that off? Dostoyevsky

Dunno. I can't read Russian for shit (pre-kindergarten level, I'd guess), but it seems like cheating to read it in English.

There’s a Milan Kundera essay (having trouble locating atm) about how most of the great writers, including the Russian greats, read the literary canon exclusively through translations (Shakespeare for example) and were no less intellectually rewarded for it.

Translation is an art I think equal to authorship. Someone below mentioned My brilliant friend which was originally written in a Neapolitan dialect but the English translation, at least for me specifically, is a monumental achievement.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#68

Post by senkora »

shermantanktop wrote: post #62

I (precocious, pretentious me) read Anna Karenina in 7th grade. It was long but not difficult. Keeping track of the characters was the hardest part. I’d like to say the story stayed with me, but alas it was the reaction of adults to my reading matter that I remember. Part of growing up was realizing that being precocious really isn’t a thing anymore at some point.

This made me smile because I did exactly the same thing (i.e. I also read Anna Karenina in 7th grade, and was very pretentious). I mostly read during lunch periods when it probably would have been a better idea to be developing my social skills.

I remember being most interested in Konstantin Levin's efforts to modernize his farm estate.

I think that at the time I thought that I understood the difficult books that I was reading fully, but looking back on it I must have missed so much. I'll need to have a re-read one of these days.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#69

Post by alex0015 »

shermantanktop wrote: post #62

I (precocious, pretentious me) read Anna Karenina in 7th grade. It was long but not difficult. Keeping track of the characters was the hardest part. I’d like to say the story stayed with me, but alas it was the reaction of adults to my reading matter that I remember. Part of growing up was realizing that being precocious really isn’t a thing anymore at some point.

This resonates with me very much. I remember being very proud of myself each time I was tested in school and I was told I was reading at such-and-such a grade level above my own. Now in my 30s, I still like reading a lot, but there's so much more to reading than finishing books.

I still have a bit of reticence toward admitting that I find some books hard or haven't finished them. I found the Iliad enthralling and the Odyssey very good, but basically any other English epic poetry or drama is such a grind and I've given up many times.

Re: Dostoyevsky isn't difficult

#70

Post by SanjayMehta »

dang wrote: post #31
ivlad wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dostoyevsky was originally published in magazines chapter by chapter, so he would end the December’s on a cliffhanger so that the readers re-subscribed

You've touched on my favorite Dostoevsky anecdote! https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21152240 . A lot of 19th century novels were published as serials. The TV of their time I suppose. With the final installment arriving by ship, crowds in New York shouted from the pier "Is Little Nell dead?" - https://www.charlesdickenspage.com/charles-dickens-old-curio...

That also explains why they're so long.
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