Live data from Hacker News

Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

apnews.com

191–200 of 203 posts

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#191
post #4

If this weren’t Deutsche Bahn, I’d say it’s a cyber attack. Given that this is Deutsche Bahn, though, it may just as well be a maintenance issue.

Well, it was a *planned* update of a central system component in their radio. That's why the restauration took only 8 hours. Their 90 min excuse is bonkers. Unplanned it would have taken much longer. Can confirm that their update planning process is abyssal. Half a year for the first simple reply. Comparable only to HP

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#192
post #175
post #52

Same problem happened two years ago. You'd think that would be enough time to figure out a failsafe routine

I think you will find it *did* fail to safe. (To suggest otherwise implies you do not understand what failsafe means!).

Granted, i guess backup is what i meant

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#193
post #4

If this weren’t Deutsche Bahn, I’d say it’s a cyber attack. Given that this is Deutsche Bahn, though, it may just as well be a maintenance issue.

Someone needs to restart some Windows NT 4.0 machine in some cabinet somewhere

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The one good thing is that they failed to take it private. Imagine how bad it would be with the current maintenance backlog and no public funding.

Rail journeys in the UK doubled after privatisation. The service was dire under public ownership because it never got enough investment.

Passenger numbers also roughly doubled in Germany 1994 to now even though there was only a weak privatisation (state-owned private company).

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#195
post #185
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the long term, sure, but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FRMCS is some way away, and I doubt they'll upgrade cab radios to 5G for the fallback path alone.

I have no idea which is cheaper, upgrading those or paying for one 2G network to remain on (at least enough cell towers to cover the railway network).

GSM-R is mainly implemented with dedicated BTSes aligned with rail line

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#196
post #195
post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea which is cheaper, upgrading those or paying for one 2G network to remain on (at least enough cell towers to cover the railway network).

GSM-R is mainly implemented with dedicated BTSes aligned with rail line

We were talking about the fallback system, see earlier in the thread.

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#197
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The New Zealand government sold their rail system, then Toll didn't make a success of it, so the government bought it back at a massive loss. Now rail is just a nightmare moneypit. But older voters love rail "it's efficient" so the government panders to them and wastes more expenditure on it. Edit: Currently for every $1.50 tax income from road user taxes and petroleum taxes: $1 is spent on roads, and 50 cents is spe…

I don't know how many travelers use train instead of a car in New Zealand, but if it means 20% less traffic on the road, those taxes are probably worthy. That's what I say to all drivers which get nervous for sitting behind me when I bike to work. Think, that if I can't bike, there will be another car on the street.

You're mixing urban and national rail. The national rail system is freight focused (and some token tourist services).

Our politicians are involved with a very large money pit for a ferry between the islands: railcars being a VERY expensive requirement (I think because terminals for rail require much more engineering). It's a mess.

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does happen occasionally, but DB tends to run, maintain and sometimes upgrade its successful (~reliable and widely introduced) rolling stock until it falls apart or is grossly outdated (40+ years old). Rail passenger numbers are increasing, so there is no need to sell stuff to downsize. The Flixtrain company uses 40+ years old IC (intercity) cars - they have no air conditioning and it's really loud inside with ope…

Hrrm. Funny. I thought that those were so called "Eurofima", which I remember as fucking cold in summer, because then their AC were set at full blast, which was annoying at the times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurofima_coach Also no real opening of windows anymore, because early onset of https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druckertüchtigte_Schienenfahrz... <- meaning pressure protection against passing trains at high s…

They did look like Eurofima cars in the article, but my memory of that train ride is pretty clear - it was just a few months ago. I guess most likely the European Eurofima fleet is in very different states of upgrade from the 70s original. I have never been on an Eurofima car with air conditioning, let alone air conditioning turned up to 11. As far as I can tell, none of them have air conditioning in Germany.

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Look at how much Switzerland spends per capita vs Germany. €477 vs €115 Your chart shows close to €200 spent by Deutschland per capita in 2024, before the abovementioned spending splurge (about €30/person/year). (The numbers 477 and 115 never appear in your source.) €230 in Berlin purchases about as much as €371 of CHF in Zürich [1]. So no, I’m not seeing evidence Germany needs to further 3x capital expenditure to…

The number €115 is in the second chart as the per capita German expenditure on rail infrastructure in 2023. I don't see €477, but it's pretty close to the €480 figure for Switzerland in 2024. My guess is they saw an old version of the page when the first chart had numbers for 2023 and have kept using it without noticing the update.

Yeah sorry I was using the wrong page and outdated numbers from the infographic I have saved. Here is the picture my numbers came from: https://www.allianz-pro-schiene.de/wp-content/uploads/2023/1...

Re: Trains halted across Germany because of communication system problem

#200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hrrm. Funny. I thought that those were so called "Eurofima", which I remember as fucking cold in summer, because then their AC were set at full blast, which was annoying at the times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurofima_coach Also no real opening of windows anymore, because early onset of https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druckertüchtigte_Schienenfahrz... <- meaning pressure protection against passing trains at high s…

They did look like Eurofima cars in the article, but my memory of that train ride is pretty clear - it was just a few months ago. I guess most likely the European Eurofima fleet is in very different states of upgrade from the 70s original. I have never been on an Eurofima car with air conditioning, let alone air conditioning turned up to 11. As far as I can tell, none of them have air conditioning in Germany.

Maybe they upgraded them without the AC, or they are based on slightly different wagons.

Anyway, in the 80ies they had AC. In Germany, als die Bahn noch kam, regular IC, no matter if 4-, or 6-seat cabin(depending on class), or Großraumwagen. I remember because sometimes I've been naughty and dialed it down a little, after opening the panel at the end of the wagon with a multitool. Non-destructive, OFC :-)

Like this, but without screen, and more buttons.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b0/13-04-29...

I liked to sit on the window, and there was a metallic grille on the underside of the window. With small slits, maybe 2 to 3 cm long, 3mm wide, a few 100 at all? And that blasted right into your face, or your side if you sat upright, or leaned back. Not noisy, just cold.

Different, probably later design, and apparently adjustable.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/5c/13-04-29...

In the Nahverkehrswagen (Silberlinge) it was different. They had no AC, just heating. Which you could turn down or fully off with an open lever. Nobody ever did that. Except me :-) At least their windows could be opened by pushing the upper half down.

https://www.360cities.net/image/abnrz-silberling-nahverkehr-...

Post reply on HN