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Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

paolino.me

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Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#51

Post by FLHerne »

> Which leaves the only real question. Why 25,000 at all? It is my company and my risk. If I want to start with nothing, that is my call, not a toll the state collects before it will let me try.

> And the cheap door has a price of its own: to some clients, “UG” reads as “not serious,” and they would rather deal with a GmbH

The post itself explains exactly why the first complaint is a fallacy and the second one is true:

> The simplest setup is a sole proprietorship [...] also makes me personally liable for everything. A client sues? They are not suing a company. They are suing me. My savings, my apartment, my name.

> So I wanted real limited liability, which means a company.

The liabilities of a limited-liability company aren't your risk.

The people who stand to lose out if your company folds are not you but your customers, creditors and anyone else with a claim to more than the company can repay.

The more capital it has, the less likely it is to collapse while having more liabilities than assets.

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#52

Post by GL26 »

VadimPR wrote: post #8

Before Europe gets lumped in as one country, founding a company in Netherlands and Sweden, speaking from personal experience, is a breeze. Although Sweden is a bit strange in the fact that banks have as much equal say as the government authority does in you starting a company, and if they don't want you as a customer, they can simply deny the right for your company to start!

Once had a call with a Netherlands founder (i am european too), and told me "Declare your company in Delaware, everything will be much easier"

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#54

Post by InsideOutSanta »

> Which leaves the only real question. Why 25,000 at all? It is my company and my risk. If I want to start with nothing, that is my call, not a toll the state collects before it will let me try.

But it was his call. As the author has already pointed out, he could have started a sole proprietorship, but he did not want to take on that risk. The 25'000 is because it's not his risk if he starts a GmbH, it's the GmbH's risk.

Also, the 25'000 are not a toll, it's the company's Stammkapital. The GmbH owns that money. And afaik, in Germany you only have to pay in half of the 25k.

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#55

Post by ExoticPearTree »

lnsru wrote: post #19

I am an electrician. Got my certification done with Handwerkskammer, went to the city hall, registered my company and filled online form rejecting the option with VAT number since all my clients are in greater Munich area. Same path could be chosen with VAT number. Ranting about choosing most complex business form and having no money for a consultant is not adequate in my eyes. Btw I am always liable as electrician (…

> Ranting about choosing most complex business form and having no money for a consultant is not adequate in my eyes.

You shouldn't need a consultant to open a company. Should be a form and that's it. Maybe an accountant to certify your books, but that's it.

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#56

Post by something765478 »

VadimPR wrote: post #8

Before Europe gets lumped in as one country, founding a company in Netherlands and Sweden, speaking from personal experience, is a breeze. Although Sweden is a bit strange in the fact that banks have as much equal say as the government authority does in you starting a company, and if they don't want you as a customer, they can simply deny the right for your company to start!

> Although Sweden is a bit strange in the fact that banks have as much equal say as the government authority does in you starting a company, and if they don't want you as a customer, they can simply deny the right for your company to start!

Wait, how does that work? Are you saying that if the bank doesn't like me, instead of just denying me a loan, they can convince other banks not to loan to me as well?

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#57

Post by AmazingTurtle »

I founded a UG with 2 friends. 7.500 capital, 2.500 each. From that money, we paid the notary. We drafted with chatgpt on our own and presented it to an attorney for review, ~300€. Notary ~1.200€. All in all, we are 1.5 years in, we still have ~3.000 left from that 7.500 capital. Obviously you're doing something wrong

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#58

Post by sevenzero »

scarmig wrote: post #41
sevenzero wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So basically you go for the legal stuff only really big companies use (instead of changing once its necessary) because you dont believe in your own product and dont want to be held liable, got it.

Do people in Germany see limited liability as some kind of crazy thing only a scammer would want?

Depends. Given OP built yet another AI tool, yea, I want to hold them liable in case something goes wrong (not that I'd buy these tools in the first place).

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#59

Post by earcar »

Lucasoato wrote: post #47

Why so little? You are priviledged! Imagine 3 young Italians that would like to work together in a startup. Let's consider only the first year, imagine a B2B SaaS, they are incorporating but they'll work on the product and approach possible customers. Zero revenue. Well, if you followed the law, you probably would spend something between 23'000€ and 25'000€ in total. WITH NO REVENUE. This is because even if you work…

That sucks, my fellow Italian. I haven't looked into our country since I live abroad for a long time, but I'm also paying health insurance here which is not cheap at all, and haven't added it to the post since it's not necessarily a company spend.

Cordiali saluti!

Re: Founding a company in Germany: €9600, 152 days and I still can't send an invoice

#60

Post by ExoticPearTree »

lbriner wrote: post #33
jingpostmedia wrote: post #15

[flagged]

This does bring its own share of problems. 1000s of companies are registered in the UK with literally no checks. No address checking so people just pick a random address to register from the phone book! When it comes to tax issues etc. it turns out the company registration is meaningless. The sweet spot has to be somewhere in the middle. Starting a company shouldn't be something you expect to do in a day but it also…

> When it comes to tax issues etc. it turns out the company registration is meaningless.

Taxes have nothing to do with the physical location of the company. You go after the owners, and I'm pretty sure you can't open a company in the UK anonymously.

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