Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

lse.ac.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

281–290 of 505 posts

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#281

Post by jerlam »

omnimus wrote: post #273
traxler wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: Do we have data that collaborates the theory that AC's prevent heat deaths and it's not due to confounding variables like the air in Nevada being dryer (dry heat is more bearable than wet heat) or the people in Nevada having year round higher temperatures and just being more acclimated? Has been on my "to research" list for a while. I agree with you that Europeans should stop being so stingy with AC…

Exactly. The recent heat deaths I saw were people getting heart attack from jumping into cold river and others mostly from dehydration. All are from outside. You will not die from sleeping in 30c. What europe will have to get used to is slow down over the mid day when the heat is worst.

You're describing a siesta, which is from Southern Europe (among other places).

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#282

Post by fy20 »

human305893 wrote: post #13
shitloadofbooks wrote: post #6

"Extreme Heat" seems to be 37-40 degrees Celsius which is bafflingly mundane to me as an Australian who grew up in rural New South Wales. We'd pack 30 kids and a teacher into an un-airconditioned classroom with just a ceiling fan and the windows open in that temperature. I imagine the buildings there just aren't built to support that heat plus the body height of hundreds or thousands of attendees?

Euro buildings are built to keep heat in. Aus buildings are leaky tents.

If they are insulated properly (lots of roof insulation) it also keeps the heat out. I'm building a house and last week it reached 32c here, inside got no warmer than 23c on the upper floor. I don't have AC installed yet, just HRV.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#283

Post by dranudin »

rwmj wrote: post #274
dranudin wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is, unfortunately. You cannot install AC, with an outside unit, without approval of your landlord. Lots of people are renting, e.g in Germany. Of course, one can get an indoor unit an seal the window. But it is heavy and takes up a lot of space in a small urban rental..

Changing the goalposts. We've gone from saying that Europe has (never defined) laws that prevent anyone from installing AC, to saying that tenants cannot make major changes to their properties. Landlords can install AC fine. Home owners can install AC. There are no laws that prevent installation of AC in Europe.

I don't think it is changing the goalpost. The law prevents more than half of Germany's inhabitants from installing ACs, because they are renters. Also landlords cannot just install AC just fine. If you just own an appartement, you need the consenst of all other owners in the building. This is also a law. Therefore, practically no landlord will agree to the request to install outside AC, unfortunately.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#284

Post by Aeolun »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #129
Aeolun wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more that air conditioning is (currently) prohibitively expensive. The few people I know that have it spent several thousands of euros on their installations. That's not something most people have lying around. You'd think the government could subsidize aircon like they did solar for years, and both of those things combined would translate to very pleasant summers spent in energy neutral air conditioned…

A basic window AC unit costs a few hundred bucks.

Not anywhere I’m aware of. Maybe the outer unit, then you need the inside, you need a licensed technician to install it, you need it to not look hideous and tank your house price. There is several thousand euros. You also need a larger unit because the rooms are too large to take one of the smaller units.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#285

Post by asdff »

crote wrote: post #234
zarzavat wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An AC unit essentially requires just a small hole in the wall and a bracket to hold the compressor unit. Europeans have walls don't they? I'm European and I have a wall that could host an AC unit. The barrier is regulatory not engineering.

By all means install an AC unit to deal with the worst of it. Just install shades as well when you've got the scaffolding out so you can install a smaller, cheaper, and less energy-hungry one. Unfortunately I personally live in a highrise, and in a rental unit, so that "small hole and a bracket" definitely isn't an option for everyone.

If you can open a window at all you can run a portable AC unit. Even just 3-4 inches is enough.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#287

Post by imp0cat »

ajmurmann wrote: post #239
crote wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at the population graph of a city like Las Vegas. It basically didn't exist before the invention of AC. Window units don't work in most of Europe because our windows aren't compatible with them. If they were, I would have one . And again, it doesn't solve the core cause. If you want to cool down your home, your first step should be to stop heat from entering . If you can get the same result from €900 of shades a…

I was under the same impression about window units till recently as well. However, I learned that there are units with hoses and foam seals that just require to put the window on tilt and then the hose goes out at the top and the surrounding area is sealed with the foam. Not as good as a minisplit but it works and is DIY.

The single hose units work. They have a lot of downsides though. They are heavy, loud and require a supply of fresh air. That means that your either do not block the window completely and draw hot air in, thus reducing the available cooling capacity of the unit, or seal the window and the unit will create low pressure area in your home and draw the air from elsehwere (via other leaking doors, windows or even bathroom fans - which can be a bit smelly).

tl;dr If you are considering a portable AC unit, try to get a dual hose one, or save for a mini/multi split.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#288

Post by barrenko »

omnimus wrote: post #273
traxler wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: Do we have data that collaborates the theory that AC's prevent heat deaths and it's not due to confounding variables like the air in Nevada being dryer (dry heat is more bearable than wet heat) or the people in Nevada having year round higher temperatures and just being more acclimated? Has been on my "to research" list for a while. I agree with you that Europeans should stop being so stingy with AC…

Exactly. The recent heat deaths I saw were people getting heart attack from jumping into cold river and others mostly from dehydration. All are from outside. You will not die from sleeping in 30c. What europe will have to get used to is slow down over the mid day when the heat is worst.

Night temperatures over 25°c are extremely dangerous for health if continous, there's no getting around this, just get the damn ACs. In my country, we've always had "siestas", now we have ACs too.

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#289

Post by tgsovlerkhgsel »

crote wrote: post #178
lwansbrough wrote: post #9

Europeans don’t get scolded enough for their resistance to air conditioning. In terms of accounting for preventable deaths, Greece has 2x more heat-related deaths per capita annually than Mississippi has gun deaths. By comparison, the worst US state for heat related deaths, Nevada - a literal desert - has >10x fewer deaths per capita than Greece.

Well yeah, because it requires re-engineering the entire built environment! Heat waves only became a serious problem in Europe in the last decade. The vast majority of buildings predate the need for air conditioning by several decades - and in plenty of cases by several centuries. The buildings are designed around being livable in a pre-climate-catastrophe climate without needing air conditioning - which is perfectly…

How do you suggest to keep buildings livable during the decades that it takes to (as you suggest) essentially rebuild cities?

Re: Extreme Heat conference cancelled due to extreme heat warning

#290

Post by asdff »

CalRobert wrote: post #246
crote wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well yeah, because it requires re-engineering the entire built environment! Heat waves only became a serious problem in Europe in the last decade. The vast majority of buildings predate the need for air conditioning by several decades - and in plenty of cases by several centuries. The buildings are designed around being livable in a pre-climate-catastrophe climate without needing air conditioning - which is perfectly…

Even now planners are forcing people to build horrible ovens that make no accounting for heat. The planners in Ireland laughed when I talked about over heating in our self built house due to lack of eaves.

People don't value design that cools. Most all the spanish style houses you see in California, if you go back to photos from when they were built in the 1920s they all had awnings over all the windows. Those awnings are basically extinct now. Some people are even painting their buildings dark colors. They will chop down shade trees too in a quest for "natural light" aka heat they are now mitigating with a noisy central AC the whole neighborhood gets to listen to now. No one understands cross breeze and opening windows either. Just run up the AC.
Post reply on HN