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Job application asked for my SAT scores

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Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#131

Post by jleyank »

alephnerd wrote: post #80
annzabelle wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not opposed to the use of test scores, it's more the requirement that kids have the whole package of grades+activities+honors societies+test scores consistently through a phase of life that is widely understood as tumultuous for many. We're selecting for robots. There's a reason the west was so productive in terms of new scientific and technological discoveries in the twentieth century, and it's not that our scie…

> There's a reason the west was so productive in terms of new scientific and technological discoveries in the twentieth century > it's not that our scientists were the most consistent conscientious students who prepared extensively for exams and padded their resumes in just the right way. Instead, a large portion were immigrants or the children of immigrants who arrived in the US as part of trans-national brain drain…

Of late, US folks coming out of university optimize for money and head for things like finance - people who hire STEM people. Those more interested in the field than the bucks go for advanced STEM degrees. And if the Yanks don't go for the bucks, they go for the MD.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#133

Post by alephnerd »

jleyank wrote: post #131
alephnerd wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a reason the west was so productive in terms of new scientific and technological discoveries in the twentieth century > it's not that our scientists were the most consistent conscientious students who prepared extensively for exams and padded their resumes in just the right way. Instead, a large portion were immigrants or the children of immigrants who arrived in the US as part of trans-national brain drain…

Of late, US folks coming out of university optimize for money and head for things like finance - people who hire STEM people. Those more interested in the field than the bucks go for advanced STEM degrees. And if the Yanks don't go for the bucks, they go for the MD.

> US folks coming out of university optimize for money and head for things like finance...

Not really, and I say this as someone who works in VC with peers in PE, Growth Equity, and other segments of high finance.

If you have the resume to get hired as an IB Analyst you will also get hired as a new grad SWE or APM at OpenAI, Google, or Roblox where they would earn the same or more than as an IB analyst with chiller work hours.

People overestimate finance salaries - it's the same as big tech with worse hours.

> And if the Yanks...

I don't think you live here in the States or Canada and as such haven't experienced our job market.

Please butt out of the convo.

---

Edit: can't reply

> Have you experienced the US job market outside of the Valley and NYC

Yes.

Before I switched to VC, I've managed teams and hiring for teams or product lines that reported to me in North Carolina, Georgia, Virgina, Texas, Washington, Massachusetts, and Colorado, and helped open my previous employer's Prague and Warsaw offices.

I also started my career outside of Bay Area or NYC tech before my stint as a staffer.

Additionally, the majority of tech hiring in the US remains consolidated in a handful of geographical locales [0].

[0] - https://www.bls.gov/oes/2022/may/oes151252.htm

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#134

Post by rayiner »

thisislife2 wrote: post #121
ogou wrote: post #23

I have seen company descriptions in job ads that list college achievements of founders. They are invariably young Asian men. I understand that it's a cultural signifier and don't judge them. But, I also understand that I will never hear back from them because I don't share that background. So, I never apply to any job listing that references college experience of either side, other than wanting a degree in general.

Someone once told me that American work culture used to be based more on intern-ship / apprentice type hiring but now obsess with formal degrees. I wonder how much of this shift in culture is influenced by the Korean, Chinese and Indian immigrants, as a formal education is a prerequisite to compete in these countries' job market? For example, it is quite common in India for employers to ask for our 10th and 12th stan…

> I wonder how much of this shift in culture is influenced by the Korean, Chinese and Indian immigrants

I think there’s an influence, but it’s amplifying a pre-existing trend. Bureaucratic societies favor formal credentials. The U.S. has become much more bureaucratic since the mid-20th century, and credentialism has grown. Reliance on degrees and other formal credentials also enables the universities to achieve political goals through admissions and grading policies. Asian immigrants in the U.S. have readily adapted to that system.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#135

Post by thisislife2 »

dominotw wrote: post #72
amazingamazing wrote: post #5

Company is Alpha Vantage: https://beaverhand.com/apply/alpha-vantage-gtm-team-various-...

airbnb asked me why i didnt go iit in india and interviever soured after that. it was a chinese guy.

Seriously? This made me lol.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#136

Post by rayiner »

buildsjets wrote: post #40

You cannot use the SAT as a metric to compare different cohorts. SAT scoring has been revised many times over the years. When I took it the highest possible score was 1600. From 2004 through 2016 the highest score was 2400. Now it is back to 1600 again. Plus, both the content and the format of the exam has changed many times over the years. At times, there was no essay requirement, at times the essay was required, an…

Yeah they’re much easier now.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#137

Post by jleyank »

alephnerd wrote: post #133
jleyank wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of late, US folks coming out of university optimize for money and head for things like finance - people who hire STEM people. Those more interested in the field than the bucks go for advanced STEM degrees. And if the Yanks don't go for the bucks, they go for the MD.

> US folks coming out of university optimize for money and head for things like finance... Not really, and I say this as someone who works in VC with peers in PE, Growth Equity, and other segments of high finance. If you have the resume to get hired as an IB Analyst you will also get hired as a new grad SWE or APM at OpenAI, Google, or Roblox where they would earn the same or more than as an IB analyst with chiller w…

Have you experienced the US job market outside of the Valley and NYC?

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#138

Post by cute_boi »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #46
delichon wrote: post #28

Last month 2,400 University of California faculty asked for admissions to resume using the SAT "to ensure foundational fluency." Of course many employers want to ensure that too, especially when college degrees don't anymore. The widening abilities gap followed the 2020 elimination of the SAT/ACT, a temporary measure that has now become a permanent vulnerability. This outcome was explicitly predicted by the Academic…

SAT score is known to be predictive of college grades. Is it also predictive for whether a mid-to-late career candidate will pass a phone screen? It is used for early career candidate filtering in finance, but I have not heard of anybody caring beyond that because of the availability of signal on the actual tasks they will be performing.

> Is it also predictive for whether a mid-to-late career candidate will pass a phone screen?

The answer is probably no. I got many friend they got good marks in SAT, but they were average.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#139

Post by JackFr »

georgeecollins wrote: post #76
ogou wrote: post #23

I have seen company descriptions in job ads that list college achievements of founders. They are invariably young Asian men. I understand that it's a cultural signifier and don't judge them. But, I also understand that I will never hear back from them because I don't share that background. So, I never apply to any job listing that references college experience of either side, other than wanting a degree in general.

I think it is a positive for an employer to ask for an SAT because it tells me right away I don't want to work for them. Once (a long time ago) I tried to upload my resume to apply for a job. The web page started asking me very basic questions, like a basic aptitude test. I was out. Tell me you do not know how to find and evaluate talent!

It was required at my first job in 1989, for entry level actuaries.

In fairness, part of job performance was passing the actuarial exams, the first two of which were calculus and statistics. I imagine testing well on the SATs for a math or EE degree (what they hired) was a good indicator of passing tests.

Re: Job application asked for my SAT scores

#140

Post by LewisVerstappen »

georgeecollins wrote: post #76
ogou wrote: post #23

I have seen company descriptions in job ads that list college achievements of founders. They are invariably young Asian men. I understand that it's a cultural signifier and don't judge them. But, I also understand that I will never hear back from them because I don't share that background. So, I never apply to any job listing that references college experience of either side, other than wanting a degree in general.

I think it is a positive for an employer to ask for an SAT because it tells me right away I don't want to work for them. Once (a long time ago) I tried to upload my resume to apply for a job. The web page started asking me very basic questions, like a basic aptitude test. I was out. Tell me you do not know how to find and evaluate talent!

The filter works both ways so it makes sense. Those employers do not want to hire people like you either.
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