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Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

fca.org.uk

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Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#11

Post by Pawenniag »

cjs_ac wrote: post #6
greengreengrass wrote: post #5

Disappointing that it seems difficult to actually sign up for – "real-time view" hidden behind layers of legalese and licensing, although it's pleasing to see the fees are effectively nothing for individuals or small firms. They're not exactly in the SaaS-era of live demos or trivial sign-ups for immediate access, are they? Why do we insist on actually useful interfaces into the economy and banking system being hidde…

There’s also a lot of bureaucracy involved in participating in the gilt market directly, rather than using an intermediary. https://www.dmo.gov.uk/investor-information/retail-investors... I don’t think the Treasury really wants to deal with amateurs.

That's probably true

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#12

Post by andy_ppp »

AdamN wrote: post #8
gib444 wrote: post #3

Will this help us see how badly Burnham bungs bonds in real time? I jest I jest

Burnham being PM is already pretty well priced in. When he walked back comments a few weeks ago they corrected and my sense is that the market understands that unless there until actual laws or budgets are promulgated, what is said by Burnham isn't really market moving.

What is he going to do without the bond markets - the UK is in so much debt we basically need to jump however high they tell us to, unless he plans to default which would destroy the global financial system and destroy the UK for decades. The only way I can see out of this is to absolutely frack the crap out of the UK and push for more North Sea oil drilling. But we definitely won't do that so maybe we'll try a bit of fascism instead? I'm very unconvinced taxing rich people is possible (unless it is a global agreement) - most of their money can be moved into tax havens and other jurisdictions where HMRC will struggle to tax them.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#13

Post by mark_l_watson »

Potentially, the raising interest rates because investors don’t trust the long term stability of the UK economic system (more spending on pro-war activities, sluggish economic growth, and higher than expected government borrowing) will crash their financial system.

I hope I don’t sound too selfish but I am a USA citizen, and I would rather worry about my own country’s medium-term financial future.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#14

Post by monkeydust »

andy_ppp wrote: post #12
AdamN wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Burnham being PM is already pretty well priced in. When he walked back comments a few weeks ago they corrected and my sense is that the market understands that unless there until actual laws or budgets are promulgated, what is said by Burnham isn't really market moving.

What is he going to do without the bond markets - the UK is in so much debt we basically need to jump however high they tell us to, unless he plans to default which would destroy the global financial system and destroy the UK for decades. The only way I can see out of this is to absolutely frack the crap out of the UK and push for more North Sea oil drilling. But we definitely won't do that so maybe we'll try a bit o…

I think ...or hope...he ends more right than left and manages to do what Starmer failed to do a year ago which is to make major reforms to the Welfare system. Its just not sustainable.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#15

Post by jalev »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #13

Potentially, the raising interest rates because investors don’t trust the long term stability of the UK economic system (more spending on pro-war activities, sluggish economic growth, and higher than expected government borrowing) will crash their financial system. I hope I don’t sound too selfish but I am a USA citizen, and I would rather worry about my own country’s medium-term financial future.

The UK's financial system made it out battered but bruised in the 70s which were a magnitude worse than what we have right now (double digit unemployment, inflation double digit, interest rates at like 15%, an IMF bailout...). Any talk of the British financial system collapsing is as realistic as the S&P500 dropping 50% in the near future: sure it can happen but the chances are so statistically small you have a better chance of winning the lottery.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#16

Post by noir_lord »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #13

Potentially, the raising interest rates because investors don’t trust the long term stability of the UK economic system (more spending on pro-war activities, sluggish economic growth, and higher than expected government borrowing) will crash their financial system. I hope I don’t sound too selfish but I am a USA citizen, and I would rather worry about my own country’s medium-term financial future.

If I was American I’d be worried about the US as well.

You elected a circus.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#17

Post by monkeydust »

pjc50 wrote: post #7
cjs_ac wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s also a lot of bureaucracy involved in participating in the gilt market directly, rather than using an intermediary. https://www.dmo.gov.uk/investor-information/retail-investors... I don’t think the Treasury really wants to deal with amateurs.

No, but you can hold them through the standard range of intermediaries and still get the tax advantage. NS&I offer a range of retail products - https://www.nsandi.com/guaranteed-returns is a good option but does NOT come with the tax exemption.

the tax exemptions make it very attractive place to hold cash versus bank accounts - if your a UK citizen google (or AI) - low coupon gilt investing.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#18

Post by alex_duf »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #13

Potentially, the raising interest rates because investors don’t trust the long term stability of the UK economic system (more spending on pro-war activities, sluggish economic growth, and higher than expected government borrowing) will crash their financial system. I hope I don’t sound too selfish but I am a USA citizen, and I would rather worry about my own country’s medium-term financial future.

>I hope I don’t sound too selfish but I am a USA citizen

The rest of the world is getting tired of worrying about the US's economical situation, whether it the dotcom bubble, the sub-primes, or now the potential AI bubble.

So apologies for being blunt here, but yes it does sound selfish to me

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#19

Post by pjc50 »

monkeydust wrote: post #17
pjc50 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, but you can hold them through the standard range of intermediaries and still get the tax advantage. NS&I offer a range of retail products - https://www.nsandi.com/guaranteed-returns is a good option but does NOT come with the tax exemption.

the tax exemptions make it very attractive place to hold cash versus bank accounts - if your a UK citizen google (or AI) - low coupon gilt investing.

Eh, for most people it's simpler to just use a cash ISA which can provide almost the same rates. Most people don't want or need to carry a huge cash float as opposed to other kinds of investment.

Re: Investors get real-time view of UK bond market activity for the first time

#20

Post by Forgeties79 »

andy_ppp wrote: post #12
AdamN wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Burnham being PM is already pretty well priced in. When he walked back comments a few weeks ago they corrected and my sense is that the market understands that unless there until actual laws or budgets are promulgated, what is said by Burnham isn't really market moving.

What is he going to do without the bond markets - the UK is in so much debt we basically need to jump however high they tell us to, unless he plans to default which would destroy the global financial system and destroy the UK for decades. The only way I can see out of this is to absolutely frack the crap out of the UK and push for more North Sea oil drilling. But we definitely won't do that so maybe we'll try a bit o…

I just feel like no matter what any government does the ultra rich will find a way to get around it. Look at the US gulf south: they are in a race to the bottom when it comes to tax breaks and just giving everything away to businesses/high income earners, yet they are poorer than ever. Texas and Florida are the exceptions here to a certain degree but they are also massive states with lots already going for them. Their neighbors collect a fraction of the taxes they should and get nothing out of it except aggressive resource extraction and cancer.

Then look at the other end: are wealthy people and businesses really fleeing New York and California in droves like conservative media is portraying? Do we really see a meaningful wealth exodus occurring because of their corporate and personal tax laws? A cursory search says no. High housing costs, remote work, and just general pandemic shifts explain basically any changes there (and the number of people/businesses leaving isn’t particularly abnormal)

All of this is to say I don’t really know what the solution is for the UK. I just don’t think businesses and the super wealthy respond 1:1 to these policies in the way that politicians claim they do. They are so rich they are ultimately going to live where they want and do what they want. They aren’t going to relocate themselves due to tax policy. They will just “be rich” their way through the problem.

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