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The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

nytimes.com

31–40 of 816 posts

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#31
post #23

Unfortunately, in the car size arms race, bigger and heavier cars are safer for their occupants. "Everyone outside the car be damned" is the expressed preference of US buyers.

They're only "safer" to the driver. Large vehicles put everyone else at a higher risk.

This is "race to the bottom" logic. The only end to this logic is everyone driving giant vehicles in bubbles because "it's safer for meeeeeeeee" as they hit children in a school zone cuz the blind spot in their Ford fuck550 is a football field long.

Race to the bottom logic is rampant in this form of capitalism that we're experiencing. Everyone's excuse is valid and only shifts the baseline to more excess and extreme behavior.

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#32

I have 360 degree cameras (at toddler height), auto braking, every conceivable safety mechanism. I really think that once these are implemented, any hatred of large vehicles is just jealousy.

Jealous of what exactly? Sounds like you are trying to justify your needlessly large/heavy vehicle. Plenty of accidents still occur with vehicles that have all those features. And accidents involving large/heavy vehicles are deadlier. It’s not rocket science. On top of that they have other downsides, like increased pollution and road degradation.

>Jealous of what exactly?

Wish I knew.

>Sounds like you are trying to justify your needlessly large/heavy vehicle.

I drove a Honda Jazz until I literally couldn't fit everything in anymore. I found I could carry 4 1.2 meter galvanised steel poles at an angle before I ran out of capacity. Which worked fine for me, I wouldn't be anxious unless they were literally scraping the windshield. I could carry half a rack of servers in the back with the seats folded down, before the back of the thing would start to scrape pavement. I needed something that could do better than that when I upgraded. Most hatches and sedans were a backwards step, and Honda stopped selling the Jazz in Aus. But for whatever reason, people feel the need to comment on the large vehicle.

>Plenty of accidents still occur with vehicles that have all those features.

With reduced impact.

>like increased pollution and road degradation.

I get better distance per litre out of the big one, and if its more polluting then I don't understand why I struggle so hard with the DPF which is literally designed to bring the thing down to our honestly egregious emissions standards, I literally dream about getting it illegally removed. "Road Degredation" seems marginal at best, wider tires spreading the load out further. Seems like another engineering problem if it is a problem. The poms figured out how to prevent their CVR light tanks from causing road damage, I am sure big utes aren't that much of an issue.

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#33
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

n=1, I dated a low empathy woman who specifically drove a Chevy Tahoe due to mass for safety reasons and transporting her only child in the vehicle frequently. “Good luck to the other driver.”

On the flip side, there's a lot to be said for a low centre of gravity and it's still the case that US "trucks" get smushed by actual trucks (road trains and heavy haul outmass a tahoe). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TskUzmg6Sk (Site safety video, engine and transmission removed in example vehicle .. still ..)

Great video. She was sophisticated enough to understand the risk profile, anecdote shared to demonstrate that some folks do decision their purchase around winning the potential tonnage battle. Very “tragedy of the commons” that can only be solved with regulation. Otherwise, some will buy big because they can.

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#34

all we want are 70-series land cruisers, prados and suzuki jimnys end the idiotic chicken tax and make small trucks and utes legal again while we are on the topic, full size vans make a lot more sense than "suvs" for most families

Yeah, but no one want's to buy a mom van

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#35
post #31
post #23

Unfortunately, in the car size arms race, bigger and heavier cars are safer for their occupants. "Everyone outside the car be damned" is the expressed preference of US buyers.

They're only "safer" to the driver. Large vehicles put everyone else at a higher risk. This is "race to the bottom" logic. The only end to this logic is everyone driving giant vehicles in bubbles because "it's safer for meeeeeeeee" as they hit children in a school zone cuz the blind spot in their Ford fuck550 is a football field long. Race to the bottom logic is rampant in this form of capitalism that we're experienc…

[dead]

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#36
Yes, this is a problem. Look at a typical truck from the 90s or so, they are tiny compared to today’s trucks.

The same thing is true of cars. Today’s civic is as big as an accord used to be. There is no Del Sol.

We need to turn the incentive knobs that worked so successfully on consumption so we now work on vehicle size.

Also, about the center of gravity discussion: I used to have an old friend that spent decades in business running a body shop. I asked him once what was the worst animal for causing vehicle damage. ( This was in rural South Dakota. I was thinking cow, horse, maybe bison. ) Nope. He said most animals would go up and over the hood, just like the people in the article. He said pigs were the worst. They stay low, going right into the car and not bouncing over. Often resulting in a total loss for that car.

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#37

I have 360 degree cameras (at toddler height), auto braking, every conceivable safety mechanism. I really think that once these are implemented, any hatred of large vehicles is just jealousy.

no, it's the fact that in accidents (where you are not the cause), people die disproportionately under your giant vehicle. it's safer for you, but almost no one else.

and don't get me started on the environmental/political aspects.

why would someone questioning your selfish (I'm not targeting you personally, just voicing a general perspective) decision have anything to do with jealousy?

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#38

I have 360 degree cameras (at toddler height), auto braking, every conceivable safety mechanism. I really think that once these are implemented, any hatred of large vehicles is just jealousy.

no, it's the fact that in accidents (where you are not the cause), people die disproportionately under your giant vehicle. it's safer for you, but almost no one else. and don't get me started on the environmental/political aspects. why would someone questioning your selfish (I'm not targeting you personally, just voicing a general perspective) decision have anything to do with jealousy?

Political?

>it's safer for you, but almost no one else.

No its safe for everyone else too. It wont even let me run into a tree.

>have anything to do with jealousy

Wish I knew, its just the only thing left when driving an efficient, safe vehicle that just happens to be large.

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#39

I have 360 degree cameras (at toddler height), auto braking, every conceivable safety mechanism. I really think that once these are implemented, any hatred of large vehicles is just jealousy.

None of that fixes an inattentive driver flying down the road playing with tiktok on their phone

>None of that fixes an inattentive driver flying down the road playing with tiktok on their phone

Automatic braking does alleviate this, but also, inattentive driving is already illegal?

Re: The deadly rise of giant trucks and SUVs

#40

I have 360 degree cameras (at toddler height), auto braking, every conceivable safety mechanism. I really think that once these are implemented, any hatred of large vehicles is just jealousy.

My normal sized car is at a significant disadvantage in a collision with a full-sized SUV. This creates higher injury risk for me and my family. Larger vehicles also cause more road damage over time, which raises my taxes or reduces the quality of roads I drive on. For those reasons, I think vehicles should be taxed by weight, to encourage more smaller, lighter vehicles.

>For those reasons, I think vehicles should be taxed by weight, to encourage more smaller, lighter vehicles.

I pay higher insurance and registration fees already, I think its covered where I am.

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